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Why are paladins so dumb?
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<blockquote data-quote="Artoomis" data-source="post: 151334" data-attributes="member: 111"><p>I included a full stat block for Gibley, an 11th (almost 12th) level paladin. I admit he has the advantage of starting at 11th level with book value, since he was a replacement character and that's what we agreed to when we replaced out characters.</p><p></p><p>edit: He was built with 32 points. He's got lots of stat boosts from items.</p><p></p><p>Sorry - no stat block for his mount.</p><p></p><p>A few things to directly answer your questions:</p><p></p><p>1. A flying mount is practically a must. You could get that several ways - celestial armor for barding works well. Boots would be even better, because they let you split up the flying.</p><p></p><p>2. His mount is a celestial riding dog - a good choice, but here's a few tips. </p><p></p><p>First, argue for skill points and feats as a Magical Beast (a legitimate request, but it could be ruled either way). </p><p></p><p>Second, use the feat(s) you get to boost his saves, you'll need it. </p><p></p><p>Third, argue for stats made up with the same number of points used for characters, with appropriate racial adjustments for the riding dog "race." They are: +4 Str, +4 Dex, +4 Con, -8 Int, +2 Wis, -4 Cha; at least that's where PCGen has them. </p><p></p><p>Fourth, use Shield Other to enhance the mount's survival, as your opponents might target the mount to eliminate you as a threat.</p><p></p><p>Fifth: Argue for the Natural Armor class to be in addition to the mount's Natural AC. This could be viewed either way.</p><p></p><p>(Reminder: Choosing a celestial riding dog means it will lag behind one paladin level on the paladin's mount table). </p><p></p><p>3. He's a blast to play, with the biggest limiting factors being:</p><p></p><p>a. He's not very effective except for when he can use his Ride-By attack - then he's downright deadly.</p><p></p><p>b. He tends to get slightly seperated from the party due to charging - this makes him vulnerable to being singled out.</p><p></p><p>4. On the other hand, he can charge even when underground since he and his mount together are only medium-sized.</p><p></p><p>5. Single-classed is great. I'd take a prestige class in a heartbeat if there was one that let the mount continue advancing, but no such class exists, at least not published in a d20 book. I'd willingly trade spell progression for full concentration on mounted combat.</p><p></p><p>6. Don't even think about the leadership feat - equipping your mount will cost about as much as equipping a cohort - you won't be able to afford both.</p><p></p><p>Have fun!!!</p><p></p><p>And now for a look at my character; Gibley:</p><p></p><p>Gibley, M Halfling (Lightfoot) Paladin11 CR 11; Size:S</p><p>Type Humanoid; HD (11d10)+11; hp 94; Init +0 (+0 Dex, +0 Misc);</p><p>Spd Walk 15'; AC 20 (flatfooted 19, touch 12), </p><p>Dagger +15/+10/+5 0'/P (1d4+3 19-20/x2 Neither T )</p><p>or Dagger (Thrown) +13/+8/+3 10'/P (1d4+3 19-20/x2 Neither T )</p><p>or *Lance (Light) +2 +17/+12/+7 0'/P (1d6+5 20/x3 Neither S (Lance +2 (Light)))</p><p>or Sword (Short) +15/+10/+5 0'/P (1d6+3 19-20/x2 Neither S )</p><p>or ;</p><p>SA: Detect Evil (60', quarter circle), Divine Grace (Cha bonus add to saves), Lay on Hands (Cha bonus x lvl per day), Divine Health (Immune to Disease), Smite Evil (1/day Atk +Cha and Dam +Lvl), Aura of Courage (Immune to Fear, Allies w/in 10' get +4 save bonus),Remove Disease 1/week,Turn Undead 8/day, Special Mount, Remove Disease 3/week,+2 morale bonus vs fear;</p><p>Vision: Normal AL: LG; </p><p></p><p>Sv: Fort +16, Ref +11, Will +14; </p><p>Str 16, Dex 10, Con 12, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 20</p><p></p><p>Skills and Feats: Climb +4, Diplomacy +14, Heal +14, Hide +3, Jump +4, Knowledge (Religion) +7, Listen +5, Move Silently +1, Ride +14, Speak Language +1; Armor Proficiency(Heavy),Armor Proficiency (Light),Armor Proficiency (Medium),Martial Weapon Proficiency,Mounted Combat,Power Attack,Ride-By Attack,Shield Proficiency,Simple Weapon Proficiency,Spirited Charge</p><p></p><p>Possessions: 1.0 Amulet of Health +2, 1.0 Arrows (20), 1.0 Buckler +2 (Small), 2.0 Chalk (1 piece), 1.0 Cloak of Charisma +2, 55.0 Coin (Copper), 1930.0 Coin (Gold), 40.0 Coin (Platinum), 121.0 Coin (Silver), 1.0 Dagger, 1.0 Gauntlets of Ogre Power, 1.0 Goggles of Night, 1.0 Healer's Kit, 1.0 Heward's Handy Haversack, 5.0 Holy Water (Flask), 1.0 Lance (Light) +2, 1.0 Outfit (Cold Weather), 1.0 Pearl of Wisdom +2, 1.0 Pipe and Weed, 1.0 Potion (Haste), 1.0 Rhino Hide +2 (Small), 1.0 Ring +1 (Protection), 1.0 Sword (Short), 1.0 Vest of Resistance +2, 1.0 Wand (Cure Light Wounds), </p><p></p><p>Spells: Paladin: /2 /2 /1 </p><p></p><p>1-Bless, Bless Water, Bless Weapon, Create Water, Cure Light Wounds, Deafening Clang, Detect Poison, Detect Undead, Divine Favor, Divine Sacrifice, Endure Elements, Faith Healing, Magic Weapon, Protection from Evil, Read Magic, Resistance, Silverbeard, Strategic Charge, Virtue, Vision of Glory, Warning Shout </p><p></p><p>2-Aura of Glory, Blessed Aim, Curse of the Brute, Delay Poison, Hand of Divinity, Remove Paralysis, Resist Elements, Shield Other, Strength of Stone, Undetectable Alignment, Zeal </p><p></p><p>3-Cure Moderate Wounds, Discern Lies, Dispel Magic, Forceward, Greater Magic Weapon, Heal Mount, Know Greatest Enemy, Loyal Vassal, Magic Circle against Evil, Prayer, Remove Blindness/Deafness, Righteous Fury, Undead Bane Weapon</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Artoomis, post: 151334, member: 111"] I included a full stat block for Gibley, an 11th (almost 12th) level paladin. I admit he has the advantage of starting at 11th level with book value, since he was a replacement character and that's what we agreed to when we replaced out characters. edit: He was built with 32 points. He's got lots of stat boosts from items. Sorry - no stat block for his mount. A few things to directly answer your questions: 1. A flying mount is practically a must. You could get that several ways - celestial armor for barding works well. Boots would be even better, because they let you split up the flying. 2. His mount is a celestial riding dog - a good choice, but here's a few tips. First, argue for skill points and feats as a Magical Beast (a legitimate request, but it could be ruled either way). Second, use the feat(s) you get to boost his saves, you'll need it. Third, argue for stats made up with the same number of points used for characters, with appropriate racial adjustments for the riding dog "race." They are: +4 Str, +4 Dex, +4 Con, -8 Int, +2 Wis, -4 Cha; at least that's where PCGen has them. Fourth, use Shield Other to enhance the mount's survival, as your opponents might target the mount to eliminate you as a threat. Fifth: Argue for the Natural Armor class to be in addition to the mount's Natural AC. This could be viewed either way. (Reminder: Choosing a celestial riding dog means it will lag behind one paladin level on the paladin's mount table). 3. He's a blast to play, with the biggest limiting factors being: a. He's not very effective except for when he can use his Ride-By attack - then he's downright deadly. b. He tends to get slightly seperated from the party due to charging - this makes him vulnerable to being singled out. 4. On the other hand, he can charge even when underground since he and his mount together are only medium-sized. 5. Single-classed is great. I'd take a prestige class in a heartbeat if there was one that let the mount continue advancing, but no such class exists, at least not published in a d20 book. I'd willingly trade spell progression for full concentration on mounted combat. 6. Don't even think about the leadership feat - equipping your mount will cost about as much as equipping a cohort - you won't be able to afford both. Have fun!!! And now for a look at my character; Gibley: Gibley, M Halfling (Lightfoot) Paladin11 CR 11; Size:S Type Humanoid; HD (11d10)+11; hp 94; Init +0 (+0 Dex, +0 Misc); Spd Walk 15'; AC 20 (flatfooted 19, touch 12), Dagger +15/+10/+5 0'/P (1d4+3 19-20/x2 Neither T ) or Dagger (Thrown) +13/+8/+3 10'/P (1d4+3 19-20/x2 Neither T ) or *Lance (Light) +2 +17/+12/+7 0'/P (1d6+5 20/x3 Neither S (Lance +2 (Light))) or Sword (Short) +15/+10/+5 0'/P (1d6+3 19-20/x2 Neither S ) or ; SA: Detect Evil (60', quarter circle), Divine Grace (Cha bonus add to saves), Lay on Hands (Cha bonus x lvl per day), Divine Health (Immune to Disease), Smite Evil (1/day Atk +Cha and Dam +Lvl), Aura of Courage (Immune to Fear, Allies w/in 10' get +4 save bonus),Remove Disease 1/week,Turn Undead 8/day, Special Mount, Remove Disease 3/week,+2 morale bonus vs fear; Vision: Normal AL: LG; Sv: Fort +16, Ref +11, Will +14; Str 16, Dex 10, Con 12, Int 12, Wis 16, Cha 20 Skills and Feats: Climb +4, Diplomacy +14, Heal +14, Hide +3, Jump +4, Knowledge (Religion) +7, Listen +5, Move Silently +1, Ride +14, Speak Language +1; Armor Proficiency(Heavy),Armor Proficiency (Light),Armor Proficiency (Medium),Martial Weapon Proficiency,Mounted Combat,Power Attack,Ride-By Attack,Shield Proficiency,Simple Weapon Proficiency,Spirited Charge Possessions: 1.0 Amulet of Health +2, 1.0 Arrows (20), 1.0 Buckler +2 (Small), 2.0 Chalk (1 piece), 1.0 Cloak of Charisma +2, 55.0 Coin (Copper), 1930.0 Coin (Gold), 40.0 Coin (Platinum), 121.0 Coin (Silver), 1.0 Dagger, 1.0 Gauntlets of Ogre Power, 1.0 Goggles of Night, 1.0 Healer's Kit, 1.0 Heward's Handy Haversack, 5.0 Holy Water (Flask), 1.0 Lance (Light) +2, 1.0 Outfit (Cold Weather), 1.0 Pearl of Wisdom +2, 1.0 Pipe and Weed, 1.0 Potion (Haste), 1.0 Rhino Hide +2 (Small), 1.0 Ring +1 (Protection), 1.0 Sword (Short), 1.0 Vest of Resistance +2, 1.0 Wand (Cure Light Wounds), Spells: Paladin: /2 /2 /1 1-Bless, Bless Water, Bless Weapon, Create Water, Cure Light Wounds, Deafening Clang, Detect Poison, Detect Undead, Divine Favor, Divine Sacrifice, Endure Elements, Faith Healing, Magic Weapon, Protection from Evil, Read Magic, Resistance, Silverbeard, Strategic Charge, Virtue, Vision of Glory, Warning Shout 2-Aura of Glory, Blessed Aim, Curse of the Brute, Delay Poison, Hand of Divinity, Remove Paralysis, Resist Elements, Shield Other, Strength of Stone, Undetectable Alignment, Zeal 3-Cure Moderate Wounds, Discern Lies, Dispel Magic, Forceward, Greater Magic Weapon, Heal Mount, Know Greatest Enemy, Loyal Vassal, Magic Circle against Evil, Prayer, Remove Blindness/Deafness, Righteous Fury, Undead Bane Weapon [/QUOTE]
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