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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DM-Rocco" data-source="post: 2332433" data-attributes="member: 14451">Okay, here is the short of it, now that I am home.All pages 3.5 PHKPage 30, under alignment, he can be one away from his Gods alignment and says nothing about swearing a code of conduct.Page 33, under ex-clerics, only talks about grossly violating code of conduct required by his god.page 42, under alignment, must be lawful good (none of this up to one step away crap) and they must swear to an oath, either to a God, a king or whatever.Page 44 ex-paladins the main point here that is different from a cleric is that , he has higher standards, if he ceases to be lawful good, who willfully commit an evil act or grossly violates the code of conduct.The big difference here is of course the commit evil act. A lawful good cleric could commit an evil act if it was a one time thing or he thought it was really the only way to handle the situation and not lose his powers, not so with a paladin.  There is no bargining room for a paladin.page 103, under alignment, last paragraph:Alignment is a tool for developing your character's identity. It is not a straight jacket for restricting your character. Each alignment represents a broad range of personality types or personal philosophies, so two lawful good characters can still be quite different from each other. In addition, few people are completely consistent. A lawful good character may have a greedy streak that occasionally tempts him to take something or hoard something he has, even if that's not a lawful or good behavior.page 104, under lawful good, a lawful good character acts as a good person is expected or required to act. She combines a commitment to oppose evil with the discipline to fight relentlessly. She tells the truth, keeps her word, helps, those in need, and speaks out against injustice. A lawful good character hates to see the guilty go unpunished.To get back on track with our debate, a lawful good cleric has the liberty to act differently than a lawful good paladin. While neither should lie and neither should do evil acts and neither should be greedy, the cleric has the luxury of being able to do that on occasion while the paladin doesn't.page 44 again, under code of conduct, a paladin must be of lawful good alignment and loses all class abilities is she ever willingly commits an evil act. Additionally, a paladin's code requires that she respect legitimate authority, act with honor (not lying, not cheating, not using poison, and so forth), help those in need (provided they do not use the help of evil or chaotic ends), and punish those who harm or threaten innocents.So again, there is a difference between the two, the paladin and any other character who happens to be lawful good. Again, they are the highest in morals and the ultimate symbol of the Lawful good alignment. In addition to the alignment, they can not cheat from it like other classes can because they have a code the forbids it. If your paladin lied, then he should have lost his powers. Like it or not, they are never supposed to. I would say that 75% of all paladin are miss played, either because the player doesn't understand the way a lawful good character (times 10)should act or because the DM doesn't monitor the paladin and doesn't keep him in check.Also, I don't mind having a nice civil debate, but please don't compare me to a borg and let's try to keep this to PHK. I know that there are other paladins of other alignments, but the main question on this thread was about the basic paladin from the PHK, let's keep the focus there, otherwise, this will get out of hand. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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