Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hollywood" data-source="post: 650956" data-attributes="member: 7408">I guess you first since I never said anything about GURPS or HERO being simple, heck I never even once mentioned them in that sense.Hogwash, the commonality between D&D gamers is not all that large either.  Go check out some of the posts about minis and 3.1/3.5/whateveryouwanttocall it.  There is quite a diversity in how people play D&D, let alone what rules they use, etc.And by the same token, not all gamers get sick of learning new systems either.  Or enjoy exploring new ideas, new ways of doing things.But if you are playing a new game every week, I'd have to wonder at the amount of time you are actually playing as opposed to creating new characters, armies, or what not. Of course, if the system is fun to play its always worth the effort... doesn't matter if its superior or not to another system.  There is no one "right" system, and even if there was d20 is not it.Quality of the system is debatable as even you note that its "not the best".  But it shouldn't matter whats the best, but rather what system the game designer feels work best to describe his/her game and genre and world.  Things should not just be converted to d20 "just because".  Then again, if the system the game designer comes up with is convoluted and hard to understand, then thats a case of perhaps the game would have done better to have used a more commonly used system such as d20 to begin with.Evildmguy, yes, the core mechanic is simple.  So is the core mechanic for WEG's d6, i.e. roll X number of d6s and if they are over a certain amount you succeed.  Cores of systems are usually quite simple, its when you start adding to them to that it gets complex.   Ask any "casual" gamer if they understand AoO, how partial actions work, what core feats do what to give more attacks and whether these extra attacks can be used on a partial, standard or full action, etc.  Or maybe what's a critical hit?  A double move?  Can you turn while you run?  And on and on.  You can ask the same questions about any gaming system once you go beyond the "core mechanic". d20 as a game system is actually fairly complex.  If you take the OGL'd part of it and trim out the "fat", sorta like say M&M [ignore the super powers and gadgets] does with removing class, AoO, streamlining critical hits, ditching of hit points, etc. the core system gets easier.   Ditch Saving Throws and just have skills and feats to represent your character where it all uses the same d20 core mechanic you mentioned, the system gets even easier to use.Yes, it is closer than previous editions.  But no, it doesn't do all that good of job of it either.  Take a level of Rogue and you still get the Traps ability and exclusive skills, yet not all rogues are thieves.  Take a level of cleric and you can turn undead, take a level of ranger and you are a two-weapon wielding master.  Outside of use of Rule Zero, which makes any game extremely complex, there are certain things that are always the same.   In a sense, its like Legos.  The more pieces you use to build something the more your vision can be fleshed out, i.e. if you use 100 pieces to build a fighter miniature, its very bare bones.  If you use a million pieces you can create quite the fighter miniature, although its no longer really I miniature I suppose.Anyways, I think  TeeSeeJay hit it on the head with three solid reasons to convert to d20.  Its got a large mass of people playing it in one guise or another and its got Hasbro's money behind it for marketing.</blockquote>

Verification