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Message: <blockquote data-quote="CCamfield" data-source="post: 1467735" data-attributes="member: 8123">The loss of a hit die on average is kind of bad, but knowing that you'll never roll a 2 or 3 is good too.  Sleep can still be a killer spell; in the last game session I played in, we were attacked by a pretty large force (for our 6th level group of 5 characters) of fighter-barbarian orcs, some very minor demons, and three ogres.  An entangle spell slowed down some of them - thank god - but the three ogres were coming in from the north near the end of the fight.The drow bard cast sleep on one of them.  It failed its save, and the lizardman fighter who had engaged them (he has a huge AC, but three on one did NOT look good) then cut off his head with a coup de grace.  They did the same thing again on the next round; I forget how the last one died.  But two sleep spells turned what looked like an overwhelming last group of enemies into swiss cheese.</blockquote>