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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Felon" data-source="post: 4603395" data-attributes="member: 8158">Well, that makes having a 17th-level power for disarming an opponent kind of a gyp. If there's a detailed, comprehensive set of rules for how to perform those maneuvers, it's not on page 42 of the DMG, that's for sure. The "page 42" rebuttal has become rather overused. It's a pat response on these  forums, as if that one page actually provided a comprehensive set of tools for crafting any action under the sun. The ripeness and novelty of it has expired IMO. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" />Let me brush off the glitter and get down to the nitty-gritty. Here's what page 42 really amounts to: it's a nice little use of a page that makes a few simple, helpful suggestions on how to improvise a very basic, damage-only attack. It tells you to make a call about what the attack is based off of, what defense it targets, and then it provides a table for improvising damage. That's pretty much it. It's better than nothing, certainly, but it is far, far, far from a complete, universal toolset for action-crafting. It is not a cure for all ills. It is not the answer to all the posts that it's been presented as the answer to. For one thing, attaching effects and conditions aren't covered there, and there certainly should be some issues to address attaching a cost to improvised attacks that duplicate the effects of powers. There has to be some opportunity cost, some trade-off, some condition that has to be filled, or so forth. Otherwise, the point of burning an encounter or daily power to achieve an effect is moot. If they should present that kind of meta-toolset at some point in the future--with examples like Trip and Disarm--I'm all eager eyes and ears. OK, I'm sweeping away the glitter again. Don't see anything underneath. Lemme rap my knuckless on it. "Substance? Hello? Are you in there?" Hmm. Kinda hollow. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />All kidding aside. here's our disconnect: it sounds like you're seeing a house where I'm just seeing a little bit of foundation. How about at least some examples on how to DIY? In fact, how about just going to the combat section of the PHB, and actually put those examples there like they were real honest-to-gosh, sink-your-teeth-into-them rules.Look, I'm not trying to bash abstraction or improvisation, but here's the thing: I already know I can go into my kitchen and just throw handfuls of stuff into a pot and try to make a stew out of it. I don't need the prologue of a cookbook to tell me that. What I want from a cookbook is a recipe. Maybe a few recipes, even. I think that's a pretty reasonable expectation.</blockquote>

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