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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Doug McCrae" data-source="post: 4982443" data-attributes="member: 21169">Grim and Gritty, to me, suggests low level PCs, low magic (both in the setting and in terms of availability to PCs), 'realism' and a dark feel - cynicism, a lack of optimism. An urban setting, particularly with a focus on the seamier elements of urban life, such as crime, seems particular appropriate to GnG.Default D&D isn't very GnG, imo. It's what I would call high magic - half the party are casters, everyone uses magic items. It deviates very greatly from real life. The setting is a bizarre underground realm filled with monsters and general weirdness. Otoh the default D&D PC's attitudes are very dark - he's a mercenary, a killer motivated by the desire for wealth and power. A D&D game that puts an emphasis on thieves, thieves' guilds and the like would be moving in a more GnG direction.I see the 'grim' part of GnG as meaning dark, and the 'gritty' part as meaning realistic, down to earth, resembling the world we know. Supernatural horror is definitely grim, but the magical element makes it less gritty. If the Evil is just a human serial killer without magic powers, then that would be more gritty.OK, so that's what I mean by 'Grim and Gritty'. Given that definition, I think Emirikol is right, in general. GMs have more of a preference for GnG than players do. The reasons are simple enough. Low power, low magic games are easier to manage. It's easier to plausibly challenge and threaten the wellbeing of PCs at 1st level than at 20th. What they can do is much more predictable. It's also easier to build a low magic world as one can make more use of history and real world knowledge.There's also the ever present tendency in rpgs for the players to want more power for their characters, while the GM tries to thwart them from achieving that power. Or at least put obstacles in their way. Thus the players are, in a sense, constantly trying to make their PCs less GnG, while the GM is trying to keep them that way. One could see D&D as a game in which the PCs start out 'Grim and Gritty' and try to become 'High Fantasy'. Because of it's uniquely long level track, the huge gulf in power between low and high level, D&D is perhaps the only rpg where the players are trying to change the genre of the game. If the genre does change, that means they won.Now ofc there is also, running in parallel, the matter of personal taste. As a lot of people have mentioned in this thread, some prefer a grimmer, grittier approach BOTH as player and as GM. BUT just because that preference exists does not mean that there aren't also other forces at work.</blockquote>

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