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<blockquote data-quote="Pedantic" data-source="post: 9016521" data-attributes="member: 6690965">I'm really talking about a broader design attitude. Like, the phrase &quot;the DM will set the DC&quot; is something I'd prefer not to see in a book I'm consuming. Much like the rule zero discussion, if a DC cannot be determined despite a fairly exhaustive list, then it should be clear that the GM ought to reason an analogous task from the existing set and use it but that should be an exceptional state of affairs the design seeks to avoid, instead of a normative process of play.Plus, stealth is generally quite poorly defined, mostly WRT the frequency of checks, the situations in which you can hide and what being hidden allows you to do. You can absolutely imagine a warehouse with stacks of crates and scattered guards, despite identical navigation by a PC and a specified map resulting in two different GMs calling for differing numbers (and possibly difficulties) of checks, or not even requiring or allowing skill checks at various points.My point about incompleteness not being good or interesting sits nicely here. I'd prefer TTRPGs strive to provide a sufficiently complete set of interaction rules that players can confidently call for them and understand/expect their consistent application.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Pedantic, post: 9016521, member: 6690965"] I'm really talking about a broader design attitude. Like, the phrase "the DM will set the DC" is something I'd prefer not to see in a book I'm consuming. Much like the rule zero discussion, if a DC cannot be determined despite a fairly exhaustive list, then it should be clear that the GM ought to reason an analogous task from the existing set and use it but that should be an exceptional state of affairs the design seeks to avoid, instead of a normative process of play. Plus, stealth is generally quite poorly defined, mostly WRT the frequency of checks, the situations in which you can hide and what being hidden allows you to do. You can absolutely imagine a warehouse with stacks of crates and scattered guards, despite identical navigation by a PC and a specified map resulting in two different GMs calling for differing numbers (and possibly difficulties) of checks, or not even requiring or allowing skill checks at various points. My point about incompleteness not being good or interesting sits nicely here. I'd prefer TTRPGs strive to provide a sufficiently complete set of interaction rules that players can confidently call for them and understand/expect their consistent application. [/QUOTE]

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