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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Li Shenron" data-source="post: 1704108" data-attributes="member: 1465">Like you, I don't feel like the Fighter is weak at all, IMXP. However there is something which makes them unsatisfying to play after a while...It's all about FEATS of course: they should make the class very flexible, but in practice there are not very many paths to follow: if you want a melee fighter you always take Power Attack & Cleave, if  you make a range combatant you alwyas take Point Blank Shot & Precise Shot, etc...The prerequisites for feats seems to give an edge to fighters: "to get the great high-req feats, you need bonus feats to spend". But the high-req feats are not so great. And most importantly, while this idea seems to imply that the other classes are stuck with only the basic combat feats, the other classes have many other things to take with non-combat feats!Finally the feat chains also have a hard entry barrier: want to get some interesting alternative-tactics feats? Must be Int 13+ and always start with Combat Expertise. While this makes sense and has good flavor, it's very feat-costly to follow more chains. It always ends up that the player gets the same 4-5 feats in one single chosen feat chain (archery, power melee, agile defense, Int-based, mounted...), and then multiclass to look for something else. IMXP the Fighter class is the MOST USED in multiclass combination, but because it's actually hard to exploit all the bonus feats, but it is the LEAST USED as single class.The 3.5 version is only slightly better, because even tho GWF and GWS are good feats, they are just bonus but not something that makes you really thrill about them.Also it looks like supplementary books - despite the tons of feats - don't help that much after all. The diversity given to character abilities by combat feats is not nearly close to the diversity that spells give to spellcasters.These are IMHO the reasons why usually the players of fighters at mid level look forward to multiclass to get a more interesting character. But if you want to just maximise your "output damage" (my spine shivers while I write this...  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /> ), as long as you find feats that stacks I suppose you could go straight Ftr forever.</blockquote>

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