Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Why does Undead=Evil
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Incenjucar" data-source="post: 1766542" data-attributes="member: 6182"><p>Ahem.</p><p></p><p>There is no logical argument, within the confines of the D&D RAW, that shows that using the corpses of creatures in any way is inherently evil, just like killing, causing pain, imprisoning, theft, and so forth, do not have inherently evil ties (indeed, to WotC's credit, they didn't shove a bunch of alignment absolutes up our arses. at least not in the core).</p><p></p><p>For evil, you have to show malice or knowingly harming someone without remorse.</p><p></p><p>In D&D, the soul requires the body to return to. IF it is going to return. However, serfs rather rarely have that sort of spare cash. If they die, chances are, they stay dead. The body is something of a portal key for the soul, but one can well sell a portal key if one never intends to use it.</p><p></p><p>The soul leaves behind an impression, a foot print in the mud that is the body. From the way the text explains it, it would seem that the will of the former body owner creates a more complex thought pattern, more difficult to gather. Considering that a sleeping target fails all saves automatically, the dead body is actually treated as being more defensive than the sleeping living body. Notably, this same effect (sans the save, because there was no mind at any point) works for Stone Tell, and similar spells, though I'm not sure which of them were ported to 3e. However, there is absolutely no reference to how this effects the soul itself, and, likely, there is none.</p><p></p><p>Flesh is flesh. In the real world, we make use of the dead all the time. In the real world, we usually -respect- organ donors, who leave their legacy of flesh in another even after their death. A willingly-given body is basically just one big giant organ. Is it any worse to have your body be a house keeper than to be cut open and experimented on by medical students? What about when they do experiments with electricity to try and make muscle tissue move?</p><p></p><p>--</p><p></p><p>Society's acceptance isn't what's important, what's important is the motive of the individual.</p><p></p><p>If a society accepts random sexual encounters, without the consent of an individual (some strange peace-keeping tradition, or whatever), and despite their upraising, someone tries to refuse, but is forced anyways because the rapist just doesn't care what they feel, that, then, is an evil act.</p><p></p><p>However, in that same society, if someone grabbed you to take you out back, but you just accepted it with a shrug and a grin, and they did it solely out of society's ways, it wouldn't be evil. It'd just be bonobo-style.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Incenjucar, post: 1766542, member: 6182"] Ahem. There is no logical argument, within the confines of the D&D RAW, that shows that using the corpses of creatures in any way is inherently evil, just like killing, causing pain, imprisoning, theft, and so forth, do not have inherently evil ties (indeed, to WotC's credit, they didn't shove a bunch of alignment absolutes up our arses. at least not in the core). For evil, you have to show malice or knowingly harming someone without remorse. In D&D, the soul requires the body to return to. IF it is going to return. However, serfs rather rarely have that sort of spare cash. If they die, chances are, they stay dead. The body is something of a portal key for the soul, but one can well sell a portal key if one never intends to use it. The soul leaves behind an impression, a foot print in the mud that is the body. From the way the text explains it, it would seem that the will of the former body owner creates a more complex thought pattern, more difficult to gather. Considering that a sleeping target fails all saves automatically, the dead body is actually treated as being more defensive than the sleeping living body. Notably, this same effect (sans the save, because there was no mind at any point) works for Stone Tell, and similar spells, though I'm not sure which of them were ported to 3e. However, there is absolutely no reference to how this effects the soul itself, and, likely, there is none. Flesh is flesh. In the real world, we make use of the dead all the time. In the real world, we usually -respect- organ donors, who leave their legacy of flesh in another even after their death. A willingly-given body is basically just one big giant organ. Is it any worse to have your body be a house keeper than to be cut open and experimented on by medical students? What about when they do experiments with electricity to try and make muscle tissue move? -- Society's acceptance isn't what's important, what's important is the motive of the individual. If a society accepts random sexual encounters, without the consent of an individual (some strange peace-keeping tradition, or whatever), and despite their upraising, someone tries to refuse, but is forced anyways because the rapist just doesn't care what they feel, that, then, is an evil act. However, in that same society, if someone grabbed you to take you out back, but you just accepted it with a shrug and a grin, and they did it solely out of society's ways, it wouldn't be evil. It'd just be bonobo-style. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Why does Undead=Evil
Top