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<blockquote data-quote="S'mon" data-source="post: 5104067" data-attributes="member: 463">BTW I ran very high level 1e, we never had any trouble with Shapechange.&nbsp; The most powerful non-unique monsters in 1e pretty much topped out with the huge ancient gold dragon; I guess Titans were nifty.&nbsp;&nbsp; By the time PCs were 18th level though the only real threats came from uniques - Tarrasque, Tiamat (houseruled to 128 hp), Arch-Devils &amp; Demon Princes, and especially high level enemy NPCs, including Liches.&nbsp; Since you couldn't shapechange into uniques, there was never really any problem.The problem with 3e is that it sought to create balance by providing viable foes for very high level PCs, AND kept in the old Shapechange as written.&nbsp; They actually made it much worse by greatly powering up Polymorph (Self), too, a mere 4th level spell.&nbsp; Sometimes I think this was all part of Tweet's cunning plan to turn 3e into Ars Magica, with Fighter PCs as Grogs. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink&nbsp; &nbsp; ;)"&nbsp; data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="S'mon, post: 5104067, member: 463"] BTW I ran very high level 1e, we never had any trouble with Shapechange. The most powerful non-unique monsters in 1e pretty much topped out with the huge ancient gold dragon; I guess Titans were nifty. By the time PCs were 18th level though the only real threats came from uniques - Tarrasque, Tiamat (houseruled to 128 hp), Arch-Devils & Demon Princes, and especially high level enemy NPCs, including Liches. Since you couldn't shapechange into uniques, there was never really any problem. The problem with 3e is that it sought to create balance by providing viable foes for very high level PCs, AND kept in the old Shapechange as written. They actually made it much worse by greatly powering up Polymorph (Self), too, a mere 4th level spell. Sometimes I think this was all part of Tweet's cunning plan to turn 3e into [I]Ars Magica[/I], with Fighter PCs as Grogs. ;) [/QUOTE]

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