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<blockquote data-quote="Ahglock" data-source="post: 6890011" data-attributes="member: 56725">Don't you need wizard 9?&nbsp; You might get spell slots for level 5 but wouldn't you need wizard 9 to be able to learn 5th spells and not just up cast lower level spells. Though when it comes to rogues I have to ask my players what is your character concept that requires that class?&nbsp; Will a background cover what you are looking for?&nbsp; If you really need to lock pick at range are there any class features past level 3 integral to your concept?&nbsp; For me backgrounds and skills cover 90% of what i think of when I envision a rogue, I'm not sure the extra 10% is worth class levels in the rogue class. If I'm thinking thief with bigby spells I'd just play a wizard with a criminal background or a bard and take that as a cross spell selection. Rogue isnt a bad class it can be a lot of fun. But I really want to make sure I'm thinking more than sneaky dude because sneaky dude is covered by skills anyone can take.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ahglock, post: 6890011, member: 56725"] Don't you need wizard 9? You might get spell slots for level 5 but wouldn't you need wizard 9 to be able to learn 5th spells and not just up cast lower level spells. Though when it comes to rogues I have to ask my players what is your character concept that requires that class? Will a background cover what you are looking for? If you really need to lock pick at range are there any class features past level 3 integral to your concept? For me backgrounds and skills cover 90% of what i think of when I envision a rogue, I'm not sure the extra 10% is worth class levels in the rogue class. If I'm thinking thief with bigby spells I'd just play a wizard with a criminal background or a bard and take that as a cross spell selection. Rogue isnt a bad class it can be a lot of fun. But I really want to make sure I'm thinking more than sneaky dude because sneaky dude is covered by skills anyone can take. [/QUOTE]

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