Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Why DON'T you pirate?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Zimri" data-source="post: 4746140" data-attributes="member: 15991"><p>Except that, of course, we can't ever know what effect PDF piracy has on actual print copies being sold.</p><p></p><p>Amongst my group of peers downloading PDFs of products not yet bought more than 75% of the time leads to the hard copy purchased at the FLGS (so no amazon discount) The other 25% of the time we find the product not to our liking and not of use to us. I seriously can not fathom any group of people who game like we do all sitting around with laptops to read a pdf while gaming rather than passing a book.</p><p></p><p>So in our circle (and I highly doubt ours is much different than most except that we very rarely buy more than one hardcopy of a book as we prefer to share our books and thus buy more titles) a downloaded PDF leads to MORE sales of hard copies, and supports our FLGS</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Deprive the owner Permanently of the :</p><p></p><p>1. Possession: Nope wotc still has possession of exactly as many as they had possession of before. If I uploaded a virus to WOTC that deleted theirs after I made my copy then they would no longer have possession</p><p></p><p>2. Use: No they can still do everything with it they used to be able to. If I had it redacted, made it non transmissible, or corrupted it so it couldn't be opened then they could claim that they could no longer use it.</p><p></p><p>3. Benefit: This is the strongest case to be made however to make it you need to show that they were harmed in some manner. The benefit they hope to incur is obviously profit from the sale of the PDFs. So then the questions are : (and I have yet to see good answers for any of these) </p><p></p><p>A: Would the people that downloaded free illegal PDFs had ever spent the money on the legal ones ?</p><p></p><p>B: Did the downloads of illegal PDFs negatively impact PDF or Hardcopy sales ?</p><p></p><p>C: Did the downloads of illegal PDFs positively impact hardcopy sales (yes even I won't try to argue that it would have increased legal PDF sales) ?</p><p></p><p>D: Did any positive impact to hardcopy sales (either via browsing of a pdf then hard copy purchase, or exposure of the hobby as a whole) outweigh any negative impact ?</p><p></p><p>E: What has this whole issue and the handling thereof done to community of hobbyists both in regard to how we see ourselves and WOTC and how the outside world views WOTC and the hobby/hobbyists ?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I doubt anyone could prove that anyone else "intended" for people that desired to buy the PDF to be unable to do so. They can still sell to everyone that prefers to buy from them as they still have possession of all of the property they previously had possession of. Seeing as how your source also state it has to be done "permanently" are you saying you would be okay with PDFs that were unauthorized but self deleted after say 99 years ? They wouldn't be permanent.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Zimri, post: 4746140, member: 15991"] Except that, of course, we can't ever know what effect PDF piracy has on actual print copies being sold. Amongst my group of peers downloading PDFs of products not yet bought more than 75% of the time leads to the hard copy purchased at the FLGS (so no amazon discount) The other 25% of the time we find the product not to our liking and not of use to us. I seriously can not fathom any group of people who game like we do all sitting around with laptops to read a pdf while gaming rather than passing a book. So in our circle (and I highly doubt ours is much different than most except that we very rarely buy more than one hardcopy of a book as we prefer to share our books and thus buy more titles) a downloaded PDF leads to MORE sales of hard copies, and supports our FLGS Deprive the owner Permanently of the : 1. Possession: Nope wotc still has possession of exactly as many as they had possession of before. If I uploaded a virus to WOTC that deleted theirs after I made my copy then they would no longer have possession 2. Use: No they can still do everything with it they used to be able to. If I had it redacted, made it non transmissible, or corrupted it so it couldn't be opened then they could claim that they could no longer use it. 3. Benefit: This is the strongest case to be made however to make it you need to show that they were harmed in some manner. The benefit they hope to incur is obviously profit from the sale of the PDFs. So then the questions are : (and I have yet to see good answers for any of these) A: Would the people that downloaded free illegal PDFs had ever spent the money on the legal ones ? B: Did the downloads of illegal PDFs negatively impact PDF or Hardcopy sales ? C: Did the downloads of illegal PDFs positively impact hardcopy sales (yes even I won't try to argue that it would have increased legal PDF sales) ? D: Did any positive impact to hardcopy sales (either via browsing of a pdf then hard copy purchase, or exposure of the hobby as a whole) outweigh any negative impact ? E: What has this whole issue and the handling thereof done to community of hobbyists both in regard to how we see ourselves and WOTC and how the outside world views WOTC and the hobby/hobbyists ? I doubt anyone could prove that anyone else "intended" for people that desired to buy the PDF to be unable to do so. They can still sell to everyone that prefers to buy from them as they still have possession of all of the property they previously had possession of. Seeing as how your source also state it has to be done "permanently" are you saying you would be okay with PDFs that were unauthorized but self deleted after say 99 years ? They wouldn't be permanent. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Why DON'T you pirate?
Top