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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 6845791" data-attributes="member: 996">Yep, the infamous treadmill.  It was a great feature as far as providing PCs with a sense of advancement, keeping classes balanced, and making encounter-building functional at all levels.  It was even elegant when viewed from some angles - from others it looked like travesty of a mockery of a sham... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />  Sorta the point of advancement, really, to face increasingly difficult challenges.  Arguably one of the reasons most other editions of the game didn't work so well at higher levels was that advancement was too un-even whether across classes, levels, or what was needed to provide a challenge (or all the above).Walking a tight-rope should be almost routine for the 2nd-storey man at 1st level - good DEX, training, +2 for a balance pole, perhaps, maybe a background or racial bonus - you're looking at +12.  When will the fighting cleric get there?  With no investment in DEX, no training or other bonuses, and heavy armor: level 26 (+13 for level & +1 for DEX 12, inevitable at epic unless you dumped an 8 in it, and -2 for that +6 Dawn Warrior Spiritmail or whatever).  I mean, we are talking about larger-than-life heroes who have gone from fighting kobolds to fighting in an abandoned mine to fighting devils in hell, from climbing a rope to get to the next level of a dungeon, to climbing a Pillar of Creation to reach another plane of existence.   It's not so ridiculous that the virtual (or actual, it was an Epic Destiny in the PH1) demi-god can manage to cross a tightrope 9 times out of 10.  It's maybe a tad ridiculous that he'd have a need to when he can probably fly or 'port to the other side, anyway (there's that ubiquitous magic, again!), and would take trivial damage from the fall if he did fail.And, really, isn't it a little more ridiculous that he'd have gone through so much in his adventures without his balance /ever/ improving?'The masses' kept playing D&D without even noticing the edition war. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> But, yes, the edition war was probably harder on the things 4e did well, than the ones that had actual issues (like the initial skill challenge rules, or the aesthetics of the treadmill).That's an interesting way of looking at it.  OTOH, magic-users kept getting new spell levels through 18th, Druids & Assassins hard-level-capped at 14th (Monks at 17th), and multi-class characters only started to hit their more significant level caps around that time, finally giving humans their day in the sun.  So it sure seems like the game was meant to be played into the double-digit levels...</blockquote>

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