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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 7137111" data-attributes="member: 6787650">You're committing the equivocation fallacy. I have criticized rationalizing away low scores, making them of no effect. You're falsely equating that with the PHB's suggestion you can use age, among other things, to explain your ability scores.Furthermore, you're the one who already chose the mythic genre when you brought up Achilles and Beowulf and claimed that having Str 11 gets in the way of pretending to be a mythic hero. Within the context of mythic heroism, feats of strength at an early age are commonplace, even if those feats of strength are not difficult by the standards of D&D heroes. "Killed him a bear/When he was only three." Can you kill a bear with "only " Str 11? Sure. (Daniel Boone^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^HDavey Crockett.) Can you kill two snakes with Str 11? Sure. (Heracles.) It's not remarkable for a 3rd level PC, but it would be remarkable for a baby. Since you're the one who wants to be a mythic hero in this hypothetical, you're the one who wants to be "bizarre and absurd" like Heracles or Achilles, and you don't get to turn around and try to blame me for the fact that your character's history is "bizarre and absurd."Right back at you, sir.You still haven't responded to the meat of the question: if you're not okay with characters who take some time to realize their concept, why don't you insist on PCs who start out with their ideal stats, at their ideal level? (Might as well add "with their ideal treasure" too.) It's not like there aren't RPGs which do this. GURPS, for instance, is primarily about playing PC who's already mature. There is a small amount of character advancement over time, but it's on the order of getting 25-50% stronger over the course of play, whereas D&D is about getting 2000% stronger over the course of play. If you're willing to be patient with your Achilles concept until he becomes a great warrior (Level 1 => 20), why is it impossible to be patient while he grows to be a strong warrior at the same time (Str 11 => 20, or higher)?Don't bother answering that. I already know you don't have a satisfactory answer.</blockquote>

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