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<blockquote data-quote="Ariosto" data-source="post: 4862271" data-attributes="member: 80487">The matter of expectations to which Oni referred is significant -- but from my perspective no notable distinction between WotC's games. I have no dog in that fight.The question of &quot;how many rounds a combat should last&quot; may illustrate some of the disjunction. It's not a matter of so many rounds to me; it's a matter of an hour of real time versus a few minutes.Likewise, I neither know nor care much more about &quot;templates&quot; and other such rigmarole than do my characters. That is just another pile of numbers that either reflects a cause or does not, depending on whether the cause is present or not. It does not change nonsense into sense. If I wanted to play an abstract and arbitrary dice-rolling game, I would be off to the casinos.It is certainly easier to play in the &quot;by the numbers&quot; way when the situation is tightly constrained -- so many characters all of such a level going from one pre-calculated encounter to another. The constraints make for ease, though, not the way, I think. Yet that may have to do with the way I think. It is very strange to me to consider a &quot;story&quot; first in terms of DCs and ACs and levels and such.First come the tangible things, the substance and gravity of the world. Mountains are greater than men, shaped by wind and water and fire that outlast species. Creatures have characteristics shaped in turn by their inherited constitutions and by their courses through the world from birth to earth.&quot;By th' mass, and 'tis like a camel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; indeed.&quot; &quot; Methinks it is like a weasel.&quot; &quot; It is backed like a weasel.&quot; &quot; Or like a whale.&quot; &quot; Very like a whale.&quot;Somehow, amorphous mathematical vapors just don't satisfy me. Is it a weasel, or is it a whale?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ariosto, post: 4862271, member: 80487"] The matter of expectations to which Oni referred is significant -- but from my perspective no notable distinction between WotC's games. I have no dog in that fight. The question of "how many rounds a combat should last" may illustrate some of the disjunction. It's not a matter of so many rounds to me; it's a matter of an hour of [b]real time[/b] versus a few minutes. Likewise, I neither know nor care much more about "templates" and other such rigmarole than do my characters. That is just another pile of numbers that either reflects a cause or does not, depending on whether the cause is [i]present[/i] or not. It does not change nonsense into sense. If I wanted to play an abstract and arbitrary dice-rolling game, I would be off to the casinos. It is certainly easier to play in the "by the numbers" way when the situation is tightly constrained -- so many characters all of such a level going from one pre-calculated encounter to another. The [i]constraints[/i] make for ease, though, not the way, I think. Yet that may have to do with the way I think. It is very strange to me to consider a "story" first in terms of DCs and ACs and levels and such. First come the tangible things, the substance and gravity of the world. Mountains are greater than men, shaped by wind and water and fire that outlast species. Creatures have characteristics shaped in turn by their inherited constitutions and by their courses through the world from birth to earth. "By th' mass, and 'tis like a camel indeed." " Methinks it is like a weasel." " It is backed like a weasel." " Or like a whale." " Very like a whale." Somehow, amorphous mathematical vapors just don't satisfy me. Is it a weasel, or is it a whale? [/QUOTE]

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