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<blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 3763920" data-attributes="member: 48965"><p>Just one question about the above statement, if there is no actual risk, doesn't there become a point at which a player realizes this(granted it will take a little time of actual play) and even the "perception" of death starts to fall apart. What I don't get is can't this be accomplished in D&D 3.5...I can send wave after wave of inconsequential low-level CR monsters at the PC's and it will not deplete any significant resources. Or better yet, let the PC's roll or do whatever but ultimately fudge so they win every encounter. This type of play, unless a genre device in something like Star Wars, is just, after the umpteenth time unsatisfying to me as a player and GM.</p><p></p><p>I guess I just see no point in playing a game, which stresses such tactically oriented things as exact movement, AoO, combat maneuvers, etc., but ultimately makes 90% of the tactical choices I make have no, or such minimal consequences to my actions, that there is little to no risk involved. It seems pointless. Then when I actually do have real risk involved it is a life or death struggle, where the fact that I may have used one of my per-day abilities could mean a TPK. This doesn't sound that "fun" to me. </p><p></p><p>It's funny to me because I play Exalted and it's pretty much exactly as you describe above, but still has per day resources(essence) and it's whole genre is based around badassitude...the problem it runs into is that the major fights are often a more desperate feeling, life or death struggle, while fighting "mooks" is a breeze. Now this being a "genre" based game it has certain tropes that make it easy for the players to determine that mortal guards are clearly "mooks" and the fact that the Deathknight; Mourner of the East Wind isn't. Thus they have a clue as to when the fight ramps up to a level where they better be giving it they're all. I wonder how D&D will acomplish this( some type of signal that this particular fight is the one where you should use your big abilities) or will it be a...just figure it out type of thing. If it's the latter I could see the major encounters becoming even more deadly and mistaken expenditure of major resources on insignificant fights causing other problems to arise. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I have to disagree here, per-encounter abilities do not make it so that the PC's can face more <strong>significant</strong> threats without tapping into their daily resources. </p><p></p><p>A significant threat has a greater chance for a TPK or even the death of a PC to arise, as well as a greater chance the players will expend their per-day abilities. So as you send more significant threats, the only thing you're doing is increasing the likelihood of death, or the camping situation. Now, you can throw numerous minimal threats at them...but then they aren't really threats are they, and you could o the same thing in D&D 3.5...start them at fourth level and hit em with dire rats, kobolds, goblins, etc. until they get to the Big Bad.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Imaro, post: 3763920, member: 48965"] Just one question about the above statement, if there is no actual risk, doesn't there become a point at which a player realizes this(granted it will take a little time of actual play) and even the "perception" of death starts to fall apart. What I don't get is can't this be accomplished in D&D 3.5...I can send wave after wave of inconsequential low-level CR monsters at the PC's and it will not deplete any significant resources. Or better yet, let the PC's roll or do whatever but ultimately fudge so they win every encounter. This type of play, unless a genre device in something like Star Wars, is just, after the umpteenth time unsatisfying to me as a player and GM. I guess I just see no point in playing a game, which stresses such tactically oriented things as exact movement, AoO, combat maneuvers, etc., but ultimately makes 90% of the tactical choices I make have no, or such minimal consequences to my actions, that there is little to no risk involved. It seems pointless. Then when I actually do have real risk involved it is a life or death struggle, where the fact that I may have used one of my per-day abilities could mean a TPK. This doesn't sound that "fun" to me. It's funny to me because I play Exalted and it's pretty much exactly as you describe above, but still has per day resources(essence) and it's whole genre is based around badassitude...the problem it runs into is that the major fights are often a more desperate feeling, life or death struggle, while fighting "mooks" is a breeze. Now this being a "genre" based game it has certain tropes that make it easy for the players to determine that mortal guards are clearly "mooks" and the fact that the Deathknight; Mourner of the East Wind isn't. Thus they have a clue as to when the fight ramps up to a level where they better be giving it they're all. I wonder how D&D will acomplish this( some type of signal that this particular fight is the one where you should use your big abilities) or will it be a...just figure it out type of thing. If it's the latter I could see the major encounters becoming even more deadly and mistaken expenditure of major resources on insignificant fights causing other problems to arise. I have to disagree here, per-encounter abilities do not make it so that the PC's can face more [B]significant[/B] threats without tapping into their daily resources. A significant threat has a greater chance for a TPK or even the death of a PC to arise, as well as a greater chance the players will expend their per-day abilities. So as you send more significant threats, the only thing you're doing is increasing the likelihood of death, or the camping situation. Now, you can throw numerous minimal threats at them...but then they aren't really threats are they, and you could o the same thing in D&D 3.5...start them at fourth level and hit em with dire rats, kobolds, goblins, etc. until they get to the Big Bad. [/QUOTE]
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