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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Why is the Vancian system still so popular?
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<blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5882945" data-attributes="member: 54877"><p>It very much depends on the particulars of each system. However, one of the most common problems is too much freedom to swap low-powered spells for higher, or vice versa. I think high to low is usually more of a problem than the other way, but both can happen. </p><p> </p><p>Take a naive power point system initiated off of AD&D spell slots. Convert all 1st level slots to 1 point, 2nd level to 2 points, etc. Suddenly, a higher level caster can convert a few lower level spells into an extra 9th level spell. Then someone tries to fix the worst of the low to high conversion by charging 1 point for 1st, 3 points for 2nd, 5 points for 3rd, etc., with each spell slot giving the corresponding amount. Now, suddenly, a single 6th level slot lets a caster do a max magic missile all day long. </p><p> </p><p>But mainly, it takes a system that is already very generous strategically and makes it even more generous and flexible tactically. In a game designed with power points from the ground up, you'll often see some variation on scaling such that the caster can be <strong>reasonably</strong> flexible with low level, modest effects, but really has to sacrifice and dig for the bigger stuff--and the scaling is usually fairly steep after a point, often with unpredictable risks. This often leaves the caster bereft of magic when they try too much, but even that isn't such a big deal in a skill-based system, where the caster has other things to use.</p><p> </p><p>D&D is <strong>already</strong> prone to the wizard being balanced on a razor edge between hopeless drag and terribly over-powered. Power points tend to exaggerate such issues anyway. That's also, by the way, why power point house rules for D&D tend to work better for a particular group when they stick to a relatively narrow level range. Even the AD&D naive implementation isn't so bad between 3rd and 9th level, especially in certain playstyles.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Crazy Jerome, post: 5882945, member: 54877"] It very much depends on the particulars of each system. However, one of the most common problems is too much freedom to swap low-powered spells for higher, or vice versa. I think high to low is usually more of a problem than the other way, but both can happen. Take a naive power point system initiated off of AD&D spell slots. Convert all 1st level slots to 1 point, 2nd level to 2 points, etc. Suddenly, a higher level caster can convert a few lower level spells into an extra 9th level spell. Then someone tries to fix the worst of the low to high conversion by charging 1 point for 1st, 3 points for 2nd, 5 points for 3rd, etc., with each spell slot giving the corresponding amount. Now, suddenly, a single 6th level slot lets a caster do a max magic missile all day long. But mainly, it takes a system that is already very generous strategically and makes it even more generous and flexible tactically. In a game designed with power points from the ground up, you'll often see some variation on scaling such that the caster can be [B]reasonably[/B] flexible with low level, modest effects, but really has to sacrifice and dig for the bigger stuff--and the scaling is usually fairly steep after a point, often with unpredictable risks. This often leaves the caster bereft of magic when they try too much, but even that isn't such a big deal in a skill-based system, where the caster has other things to use. D&D is [B]already[/B] prone to the wizard being balanced on a razor edge between hopeless drag and terribly over-powered. Power points tend to exaggerate such issues anyway. That's also, by the way, why power point house rules for D&D tend to work better for a particular group when they stick to a relatively narrow level range. Even the AD&D naive implementation isn't so bad between 3rd and 9th level, especially in certain playstyles. [/QUOTE]
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Why is the Vancian system still so popular?
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