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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Willie the Duck" data-source="post: 9012530" data-attributes="member: 6799660">AD&D 1E PHB, Page 39: "For purposes of the game distances are basically one-third with respect to spell arid missile range from outdoors to indoors/underground situations." Fundamentally, we keep going round in circles because when the 'D&D used to be different' line is shown to be incorrect, you switch to realism. When people point out that realism isn't necessarily a goal (or which realism is important, in the case of battlefield vs Olympic target shooting), it switches to gamist concerns. It's been a one long case of chasing the goal posts all over the field, all of which ends in this they've-changed-other-things,-why-not-bows type response that doesn't fix that the case for needing the fix is where the contention lies. Absolutely, and if one does make a game with shorter effective ranges, the ability or bows to shoot greater distances in massed-armies situations is something that should be mentioned. While we're thinking that way, I'd love it if 5e pikes were re-named longspears (probably with weight reduction) and actual (18 lb, ~20') pikes listed in non-weapon equipment with a description something like "very long polearm used in formations, not really usable in PC-style situations (opponents can too easily get around an individual point)."This is always the question with games that don't really have a set 'power-fantasy' level -- is a D&D fighter supposed to be a IRL medieval soldier (just in a world with magic and dragons), a low-extraordinary hero like Robin Hood or Jon McClain, or an epic hero of myth and legend. D&D has seemed to try really hard to have it all ways with regards to those questions.</blockquote>

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