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<blockquote data-quote="Dausuul" data-source="post: 5201850" data-attributes="member: 58197">While I mostly agree with this, I think 4E to some extent confuses quantity with quality. Many of 4E's tactical elements have limited impact on the flow of combat - a situation exacerbated by the increase in hit-point-to-damage ratios - but still require tracking. Conditions seldom force a drastic change in tactics. They're just annoyances to be suffered through until you make your save.(On the other hand, forced movement has a huge effect on the battle, which is why interesting terrain is so important in 4E, and why the 4E fighter's &quot;You shall not pass!&quot; shtick puts her head and shoulders above every other defender class. IMO, of course.)My hope is that 5E will refine and focus 4E's tactical aspect. Design conditions and effects that alter the nature of the battle and force combatants to shift gears; at the same time, limit the number of conditions that get imposed. Strip away the fiddly little modifiers.Ideally, 5E's math would also work such that a low-powered monster group (relative to the PCs) deals damage quickly and is then slain, 1E-style, while a high-powered group (again relative to the PCs) results in an extended, dramatic combat, 4E-style. This would make it possible to incorporate a mix of &quot;skirmish&quot; and &quot;set-piece&quot; encounters, rather than having nothing but HUGE AWESOME EPIC BATTLES which can too easily become slow sloggy grinding battles instead.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Dausuul, post: 5201850, member: 58197"] While I mostly agree with this, I think 4E to some extent confuses quantity with quality. Many of 4E's tactical elements have limited impact on the flow of combat - a situation exacerbated by the increase in hit-point-to-damage ratios - but still require tracking. Conditions seldom force a drastic change in tactics. They're just annoyances to be suffered through until you make your save. (On the other hand, forced movement has a huge effect on the battle, which is why interesting terrain is so important in 4E, and why the 4E fighter's "You shall not pass!" shtick puts her head and shoulders above every other defender class. IMO, of course.) My hope is that 5E will refine and focus 4E's tactical aspect. Design conditions and effects that alter the nature of the battle and force combatants to shift gears; at the same time, limit the number of conditions that get imposed. Strip away the fiddly little modifiers. Ideally, 5E's math would also work such that a low-powered monster group (relative to the PCs) deals damage quickly and is then slain, 1E-style, while a high-powered group (again relative to the PCs) results in an extended, dramatic combat, 4E-style. This would make it possible to incorporate a mix of "skirmish" and "set-piece" encounters, rather than having nothing but HUGE AWESOME EPIC BATTLES which can too easily become slow sloggy grinding battles instead. [/QUOTE]

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