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Why Must I Kludge My Combat?
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<blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 5208765" data-attributes="member: 48965"><p>I will address your other points (the one's that actually try to refute my claims at least) in a moment. First however I want to examine your claims about Raiders at Oakhurst... Here is the stat block of the solo in question...</p><p> </p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><strong><span style="color: white"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Nightscale</span></span></strong></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><strong><span style="color: white"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Young Black Dragon Level 4 Solo Lurker</span></span></strong></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Large natural magical beast (aquatic, dragon) XP 875</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Initiative</strong>: +11 <strong>Senses</strong>: Perception +9; darkvision</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>HP</strong> 280; <strong>Bloodied</strong> 140 See also <em>bloodied breath</em></span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>AC</strong> 24; <strong>Fort</strong> 19, <strong>Ref</strong> 21, <strong>Will</strong> 18</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Resist</strong>: 15 Acid</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Saving Throws</strong> +5</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Speed</strong> 7, fly 7 (clumsy), overland flight 10, swim 7</span></span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Action points</strong> 2</span></span> </span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><span style="color: white"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Bite (standard; at will)</span></strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"> * Acid</span></span><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Reach 2: +10 vs. AC; 1d6 + 3 damage, and ongoing 5 acid damage (save ends) </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Claw (standard; at will)</span></span></strong><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Reach 2: +8 vs. AC; 1d4 +3 damage </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Double attack (standard; at will)</span></span></strong><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">The dragon makes 2 claw attacks </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Tail slash (immediate reaction, when a melee attack misses the dragon; at will)</span></span></strong><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">The dragon uses its tail to attack the enemy that missed it; reach 2: +8 vs AC; 1d6 + 4 damage and the target is pushed 1 square </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><span style="color: white"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Breath Weapon (standard; recharge 5 6)</span></strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"> * Acid</span></span><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Close blast 5; +7 vs Reflex; 1d12 + 3 acid damage and the target takes ongoing 5 acid damage and takes a -4 penalty to AC (save ends both). </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><span style="color: white"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Bloodied Breath (Immediate reaction, when first bloodied; encounter)</span></strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"> * Acid</span></span><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">The dragon's breath weapon recharges automatically, and the dragon uses it immediately. </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><span style="color: white"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Cloud of Darkness (standard; sustain minor; recharge 3 4 5 6)</span></strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"> * Zone</span></span><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Close burst 2: this power creates a zone of darkness that remains in place until the end of the dragon's next turn. The zone blocks line of sight for all creatures except the dragon. Any creature entirely within the area (except the dragon) is blinded. </span></span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><span style="color: white"><strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">Frightful presence (standard, encounter)</span></strong><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"> * Fear</span></span><br /> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white">Close burst 5; targets enemies: +5 vs. Will; the target is stunned until the end of the dragon's nest turn. Aftereffect: the target takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls (save ends).</span></span></li> </ul><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Alignment:</strong> Evil <strong>Languages</strong>: Draconic</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Skills</strong>: Nature +9, Stealth +17</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><strong>Str</strong> 16 (+5) <strong>Dex</strong> 20 (+7) <strong>Wis </strong>15 (+4) <strong>Con</strong> 16 (+5) <strong>Int</strong> 12 (+3) <strong>Cha</strong> 10 (+2)</span></span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><span style="font-size: 12px">...</span><span style="font-size: 10px">Now, according to my MM1 Yng Blk Dragon...his AC should be 22 not 24, his Fort should be 18 not 19, his Ref should be 20 and Will should be 17.. His defenses are all better or equal to the Young Green Dragon which is a level 5 solo monster</span></span></span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: white"><span style="font-size: 10px">HP's are increased by 56 (again more than the Young Green Dragon)... Cloud of Darkness recharges on a 3,4,5,6 instead of 4,5,6...</span></span></span></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p>This is definitely a more powerful monster than a level 4 solo lurker, so I wouldn't necessarily base your refutation of my argument on this encounter. ... I would say as a solo it falls in the level 5 to level 6 range which, as the DMG suggests +2 to +3 levels for a difficult encounter ( a level 3-4 solo is difficult for (5)1st level PC's), and as this was an encounter for level 1 PC's... it should have been almost certain death against a bunch of absolute new players. The fact that you're party as new players still beat it kind of supports my point</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Imaro, post: 5208765, member: 48965"] I will address your other points (the one's that actually try to refute my claims at least) in a moment. First however I want to examine your claims about Raiders at Oakhurst... Here is the stat block of the solo in question... [FONT=Arial][COLOR=#000000][B][COLOR=white][FONT=Arial]Nightscale[/FONT][/COLOR][/B] [B][COLOR=white][FONT=Arial]Young Black Dragon Level 4 Solo Lurker[/FONT][/COLOR][/B] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Large natural magical beast (aquatic, dragon) XP 875[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Initiative[/B]: +11 [B]Senses[/B]: Perception +9; darkvision[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]HP[/B] 280; [B]Bloodied[/B] 140 See also [I]bloodied breath[/I][/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]AC[/B] 24; [B]Fort[/B] 19, [B]Ref[/B] 21, [B]Will[/B] 18[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Resist[/B]: 15 Acid[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Saving Throws[/B] +5[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Speed[/B] 7, fly 7 (clumsy), overland flight 10, swim 7[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Action points[/B] 2[/COLOR][/FONT] [LIST] [*][COLOR=white][B][FONT=Arial]Bite (standard; at will)[/FONT][/B][FONT=Arial] * Acid[/FONT][/COLOR] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Reach 2: +10 vs. AC; 1d6 + 3 damage, and ongoing 5 acid damage (save ends) [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][B][FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Claw (standard; at will)[/COLOR][/FONT][/B] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Reach 2: +8 vs. AC; 1d4 +3 damage [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][B][FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Double attack (standard; at will)[/COLOR][/FONT][/B] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]The dragon makes 2 claw attacks [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][B][FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Tail slash (immediate reaction, when a melee attack misses the dragon; at will)[/COLOR][/FONT][/B] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]The dragon uses its tail to attack the enemy that missed it; reach 2: +8 vs AC; 1d6 + 4 damage and the target is pushed 1 square [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][COLOR=white][B][FONT=Arial]Breath Weapon (standard; recharge 5 6)[/FONT][/B][FONT=Arial] * Acid[/FONT][/COLOR] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Close blast 5; +7 vs Reflex; 1d12 + 3 acid damage and the target takes ongoing 5 acid damage and takes a -4 penalty to AC (save ends both). [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][COLOR=white][B][FONT=Arial]Bloodied Breath (Immediate reaction, when first bloodied; encounter)[/FONT][/B][FONT=Arial] * Acid[/FONT][/COLOR] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]The dragon's breath weapon recharges automatically, and the dragon uses it immediately. [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][COLOR=white][B][FONT=Arial]Cloud of Darkness (standard; sustain minor; recharge 3 4 5 6)[/FONT][/B][FONT=Arial] * Zone[/FONT][/COLOR] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Close burst 2: this power creates a zone of darkness that remains in place until the end of the dragon's next turn. The zone blocks line of sight for all creatures except the dragon. Any creature entirely within the area (except the dragon) is blinded. [/COLOR][/FONT] [*][COLOR=white][B][FONT=Arial]Frightful presence (standard, encounter)[/FONT][/B][FONT=Arial] * Fear[/FONT][/COLOR] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white]Close burst 5; targets enemies: +5 vs. Will; the target is stunned until the end of the dragon's nest turn. Aftereffect: the target takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls (save ends).[/COLOR][/FONT] [/LIST][FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Alignment:[/B] Evil [B]Languages[/B]: Draconic[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Skills[/B]: Nature +9, Stealth +17[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][B]Str[/B] 16 (+5) [B]Dex[/B] 20 (+7) [B]Wis [/B]15 (+4) [B]Con[/B] 16 (+5) [B]Int[/B] 12 (+3) [B]Cha[/B] 10 (+2)[/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][SIZE=3]...[/SIZE][SIZE=2]Now, according to my MM1 Yng Blk Dragon...his AC should be 22 not 24, his Fort should be 18 not 19, his Ref should be 20 and Will should be 17.. His defenses are all better or equal to the Young Green Dragon which is a level 5 solo monster[/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][COLOR=white][SIZE=2]HP's are increased by 56 (again more than the Young Green Dragon)... Cloud of Darkness recharges on a 3,4,5,6 instead of 4,5,6...[/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT] [/COLOR][/FONT] This is definitely a more powerful monster than a level 4 solo lurker, so I wouldn't necessarily base your refutation of my argument on this encounter. ... I would say as a solo it falls in the level 5 to level 6 range which, as the DMG suggests +2 to +3 levels for a difficult encounter ( a level 3-4 solo is difficult for (5)1st level PC's), and as this was an encounter for level 1 PC's... it should have been almost certain death against a bunch of absolute new players. The fact that you're party as new players still beat it kind of supports my point [/QUOTE]
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