Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Upper_Krust" data-source="post: 257988" data-attributes="member: 326">Re: ECL's and CR'sHi Xeriar! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Oh, okay, sure fire away! Not sure if you caught the whole discussion though obviously the pretext is that the Immortals Handbook concentrates on Deity PCs (and still keeping the campaign challenging)...Essentially SDAs need to be explained as either SU (supernatural) or EX (extraordinary). With obviously SU abilities not functioning within Anti-Magic.Generally I have found those that assign bonuses are EX; those that have an external effect SU. I have a listing of such in the IH.If you are going to allow Deity PCs you don't want to make them utterly invulnerable to non-deities (otherwise you are going to totally limit your options).I have mentioned many times that beyond a certain level such measurements of power are arbitrary and meaningless.However they still serve a purpose. On a cosmic scale players should note that there is always something more powerful than themselves.  I agree. They were for non-practical applications though. Merely an excercise in waxing philosophically.I have always been a big fan of the Marvel Universe cosmology. They generally draw the line* at something that could destroy a Star (in and of its own power) - The Living Tribunal in this case.*With one or two exceptions.However, they have an excellent scaling (similar to Divine Classes - Demigod, Lesser God etc.) whereupon the beings on the next rung of the power ladder will never be defeated by their lessers except under extreme conditions.What this means is that it should be possible (but not very likely) for lesser beings to challenge and defeat more powerful ones. Essentially you want the next rung on the ladder less than CR+8 to facilitate interaction.True. Which was why my scale was actually based on power capable of destroying (and by extension creating) such cosmic locales. Thank you. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />We had a mathematical formula that worked the scale out perfectly, but for the sake of simplicity we adopted the scale we did. The actual scale itself is less important than the fact that there should be a scale!Challenge Rating itself is not an exact science after all. Though I think the article goes some way to simplifying CR (above or below CR20).The main dilemma with Challenge Ratings is not getting them right...its to not get them wrong!Thats why the article allows a lot of flexibility, with regards ECL.I don't agree! All power is relative.Epic and Immortal Campaigns can still be balanced and challenging - the article allows the CR mechanic (and by extension Experience Points) to function at any level.Is it perfect? I would say its as perfect as anything in 3rd Ed! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

Verification