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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Why Psionics is broken and what to do to fix it
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<blockquote data-quote="Suldarr'essalar" data-source="post: 2992853" data-attributes="member: 14947"><p>1. You're reffering to the maximal damage a spell can do, right (empowered damage is not maximised)? </p><p>2. Beside the fact that that metapsionic feats also require a manifester to expend psionic focus, so without psionic meditation feat, you can use metapsionic feats once every two rounds. And of course you can't use two metapsionic feats (since you cannot be twice psionicly focused at the same time) without additional 2 feats! And if having those 3 feats you can do it 1 every 2 rounds (without psionic meditation 1 every 3 rounds).</p><p>3. Energy burst deals damage to all creatures within 40ft away from manifester. You need to get all those creatures near you before manifesting energy burst.</p><p></p><p>1. Well, a maximised disintegrate cast by 20th level caster deals 240 points of damage. </p><p>A manifester can manifest maximised disintegrate dealing 192 points of damage (using 20pp equivalent of 10.5 spell slot), or manifest a standard 40d6 disintegrate using the same number of power points. </p><p>2. A manifester in order to use 40d6 disintegrate must use 20pp (10.5 spell slot), while a wizard uses 6th level spell slot to do the same amount of damage.</p><p>3. After using all power points on those disintegrates psion can do nothing, while wizards 1st level spells (5d4+5 magic missiles) are still useful (and he didn't use them!).</p><p>Too bad it's subject to Damage Reduction.</p><p>Another thing, you must pay 20pp to get 20d6 damage of it. Hence you need to use higher level spell slot to get more damage out of 1st level power. Spells are caped because it would be highly unbalanced to let first level spell deal 10d4+10 points of damage (uncaped magic missile cast by 19th level wizard/sorcerer).</p><p>Augmentation is nothing more than an equivalent of a higher level spell slot. And shield stops magic missiles!</p><p>Check out 3rd level Greater Magic Armor from Spell Compedium and tell me how many power points must a manifester use to get that bonus?</p><p>Beside the fact that it doesn't deal any damage on a succesful save, it's close range and it's mind affecting, so at higher levels there are lots of creatures immune to this power.</p><p>To get the power of second level spell, vigor must be augmented only by 2pp. That gives 15hp compared to d10+1/level. Comperable? Yes!</p><p>Broken? No!</p><p>Good power, but mind affecting with close range. Spellcasters have high will saves, so it's not as effective as it seems.</p><p>1d6/2 levels? Sometimes it's worth it, but mostly it's beter to use 1d6/level powers <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></p><p>As with crystal shard, it's subject to DR.</p><p>Why the limitation? Seriously, I don't get it. If I have to pay 15pp on 1st level energy ray to get 15d6 points of damage its just as if I'd use 8th level power, except that augmented energy ray is still treated as 1st level power so it's stopped by every glob (i.e. lesser glob of invulnerability).</p><p>If you happen to notice it has DC of a 1st level power, it's mind affecting and close range.</p><p></p><p>So true <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>So twin energy ray if hits deals 10d6+10 to one target (11pp). You have to expend psionic focus. An equivalent of 11pp is a 6th level spell... hmm... chain lightning: 11d6 to one target and 5d6 to 11 secondary targets. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>If you'd understand, you wouldn't suggest capping powers <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></p><p>And as for being in the spotlight, try more encounters durring one day.</p><p>Psions begin small (d6 - d10 damage), and and big (40d6, bend reality, and stuff like that).</p><p>True, but he can do 17*40d6 (disintegrate) = 680d6</p><p>Sorcerer can do: 6* 5d8 [lesser orb of X] + 6* 5d6 [Snilloc's Snowball Swaarm] + 6* 10d6 [fireball] + 6 * 15d6 [orb of X] + 6*15d6 [cone of cold] + 6* 40d6 [disintegrate] + 6* 20d6 [delayed fireball] + 6* 60d6 [empowered disintegrate] + 6* 24d6 [meteor swarm] = 1134d6 + 30d8 if I'm not mistaken.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Suldarr'essalar, post: 2992853, member: 14947"] 1. You're reffering to the maximal damage a spell can do, right (empowered damage is not maximised)? 2. Beside the fact that that metapsionic feats also require a manifester to expend psionic focus, so without psionic meditation feat, you can use metapsionic feats once every two rounds. And of course you can't use two metapsionic feats (since you cannot be twice psionicly focused at the same time) without additional 2 feats! And if having those 3 feats you can do it 1 every 2 rounds (without psionic meditation 1 every 3 rounds). 3. Energy burst deals damage to all creatures within 40ft away from manifester. You need to get all those creatures near you before manifesting energy burst. 1. Well, a maximised disintegrate cast by 20th level caster deals 240 points of damage. A manifester can manifest maximised disintegrate dealing 192 points of damage (using 20pp equivalent of 10.5 spell slot), or manifest a standard 40d6 disintegrate using the same number of power points. 2. A manifester in order to use 40d6 disintegrate must use 20pp (10.5 spell slot), while a wizard uses 6th level spell slot to do the same amount of damage. 3. After using all power points on those disintegrates psion can do nothing, while wizards 1st level spells (5d4+5 magic missiles) are still useful (and he didn't use them!). Too bad it's subject to Damage Reduction. Another thing, you must pay 20pp to get 20d6 damage of it. Hence you need to use higher level spell slot to get more damage out of 1st level power. Spells are caped because it would be highly unbalanced to let first level spell deal 10d4+10 points of damage (uncaped magic missile cast by 19th level wizard/sorcerer). Augmentation is nothing more than an equivalent of a higher level spell slot. And shield stops magic missiles! Check out 3rd level Greater Magic Armor from Spell Compedium and tell me how many power points must a manifester use to get that bonus? Beside the fact that it doesn't deal any damage on a succesful save, it's close range and it's mind affecting, so at higher levels there are lots of creatures immune to this power. To get the power of second level spell, vigor must be augmented only by 2pp. That gives 15hp compared to d10+1/level. Comperable? Yes! Broken? No! Good power, but mind affecting with close range. Spellcasters have high will saves, so it's not as effective as it seems. 1d6/2 levels? Sometimes it's worth it, but mostly it's beter to use 1d6/level powers ;) As with crystal shard, it's subject to DR. Why the limitation? Seriously, I don't get it. If I have to pay 15pp on 1st level energy ray to get 15d6 points of damage its just as if I'd use 8th level power, except that augmented energy ray is still treated as 1st level power so it's stopped by every glob (i.e. lesser glob of invulnerability). If you happen to notice it has DC of a 1st level power, it's mind affecting and close range. So true :) So twin energy ray if hits deals 10d6+10 to one target (11pp). You have to expend psionic focus. An equivalent of 11pp is a 6th level spell... hmm... chain lightning: 11d6 to one target and 5d6 to 11 secondary targets. :) If you'd understand, you wouldn't suggest capping powers ;) And as for being in the spotlight, try more encounters durring one day. Psions begin small (d6 - d10 damage), and and big (40d6, bend reality, and stuff like that). True, but he can do 17*40d6 (disintegrate) = 680d6 Sorcerer can do: 6* 5d8 [lesser orb of X] + 6* 5d6 [Snilloc's Snowball Swaarm] + 6* 10d6 [fireball] + 6 * 15d6 [orb of X] + 6*15d6 [cone of cold] + 6* 40d6 [disintegrate] + 6* 20d6 [delayed fireball] + 6* 60d6 [empowered disintegrate] + 6* 24d6 [meteor swarm] = 1134d6 + 30d8 if I'm not mistaken. [/QUOTE]
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