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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GMforPowergamers" data-source="post: 6240272" data-attributes="member: 67338">I never thought about it that way... I'm not sure that's true... but for the sake of argument I will say maybe... 3e were the quickest combats we ever saw... we had 5-20 min average in 2e as well and 60ish sounds right for most of 4e... but I think we had a lot more less then 5 min fights in 3e then more then 60 in every edition combined...3e had a lot of fights end before everyone took there first turn (witch almost never happened in 2e and only happened 5 fights in 4e...and those were in a row...)My group found because fights took so long we tried to avoid them more... much less likely to pick fights and much more likely to try to find away around it.I agree between 2e and 4e... but that mostly started in 3e for us... hell those annoying 'builds' that people would plan 10 levels ahead for started for us right around 3.5... "Well I want X and Y feats and both have prereeq feats and stats and then I want this prestige class..."4e saw again less then 3e with less multi classing we had a lot of "oh I want X epic destiny, but there was no building to it... just het the level.   I think in some ways simpler more condensed rules can be better for combat... we will have to just agree to disagree... well first if WotC took 5 years off D&D I bet they could live off novel, board game, and misc (like those pdf sale and ddi) for a while just making very little profit... and if you recoupled it they could do so for ever because magic brings in more then you could ever dream D&D could...I will say what I said back when 5e playtest started... you need a more basic book. a soft cover player's guide with 4 classes and 3 races basic equipment and rules only... then the big advanced players guide and DMG My FLGS that ran both encounters and LFR had 3 or 4 of us with all the books, two of us with laptops for character builders... no newbe needed to buy anything... so I don't know I never heard that. I don't doubt you just not what I'm used too. yup my point.  me too um back to unknowable... ok I know a lot of people that's true for... when we started back in high school it was just 5 or 6 of us and 3 of them were brothers... my freshmen year of college we opened a RP club at the college and meet a lot of people that was true for... in fact I think that your 'credentials' makes you only slightly above average...wow, I have been to at least 7 Cons(most more then 3 times) I have been to Gen Con 8 times since my first trip in 2000 I have played and run in 3 states not counting Cons, and I found Most people HATE dungeon crawls in less it is only a one off...  before I posted I called the 3 players I know who have played with the most number of people... none of us think that as the 'average' experience...My friend Chris was in the Military for ever... he was in Germany playing D&D in the 90's and in Africa at the turn of the century. I meet him in 2004 He now lives here in the states and is retired but works for a government contractor... he travels all over the world some times for months at a time... he has played in 5 different countries and every time zone in the US... he is one of those 3 players I checked with... well the best system are things that can be both... let me have my choice... yea it felt like all the fighter ones were like that...one of my complaints... until we got skill powers and themes to make up for it... Non combat abilities can also be hide in plain sight, and fast talking, and find information, and stiring speech. I want just a bit more then it has now... but I agree 5e is shapeing up nice right now...</blockquote>

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