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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Majoru Oakheart" data-source="post: 6242673" data-attributes="member: 5143">It would be the same for us.  And the reason people would dislike it is because it is CHEATING in a rather obvious and large way.  I always think "If this was any other game than D&D and someone pulled this crap would we allow it?"  Like, say we were playing Monopoly and someone said "I move my car to Boardwalk because I rolled a 6 and when I roll a 6 I can move wherever I want to." I'm guessing everyone at the table would laugh, and say NO!  If we were playing street hockey and someone knocked the puck into someone's driveway and into their basketball net and said "That's one point for our team, I got the puck in the net!", we'd all laugh.  If we thought for one second that the person was serious, we'd likely be too dumb struck over the stupidity to even speak.To me, this is the exact same situation.  The game is designed in such a way that it is impossible for a level 9 party to defeat a CR 24 dragon.  The game purposefully doesn't give you abilities that are capable of harming the dragon.  In fact, half the rules of the game are literally designed specifically to make sure PCs at a certain level can only fight monsters close to their level.  Then someone comes along and says "I'd like to try something that the rules specifically say is impossible that would allow me to win when the game says I can't."Nothing wrong with this option.  If the monster was put into the game expecting a fair fight, then let them fight fairly.  If you assumed they were going to run, perfect.  They can run.  If the intent was that the PCs would need to negotiate and battle was guaranteed death...well, that can happen too.As I've said, this harms the future of the game.  It becomes a trick they can try again to defeat other creatures.  Maybe ones you actually care if they survive or not.  It also makes the PCs rather brazen.  How are you going to act when you defeated a CR 24 dragon with one spell without rolling?  You are now the ultimate badasses.  No one can ever threaten you again, no matter how powerful they are.  Just wait for them to open their mouth and throw in a wall of force.Not to mention the treasure.  A dragon of that size should have huge amounts of magic items and treasure according to the rules.  +5 swords lying all over his lair would be the common thing.  Do the PCs now get all that?  Is it good for your game for the PCs to have level 24 treasure at level 9?  If the treasure isn't there, then why?  Will the PCs now go in search of it?  With enough spells, they can certainly divine its location.Even if you don't allow the trick to work again for arbitrary reasons(and can convince your players that it doesn't work again), the addition of those magic items or to gold to buy or craft magic items of that level will clearly make them WAY more powerful than the game expects them to be for their level.Not to mention the XP for defeating a CR 24 creature should be so great that they'd all go up a couple of levels from the one battle.  If you have more battles planned for the rest of the adventure, does that now invalidate them because they are too low level to harm the party?It might only take 30 seconds or a minute.  I figure that's ample time to decide whether the party gains 3 levels and millions of gold with one spell or not.</blockquote>

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