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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 8490884" data-attributes="member: 6987520">Sorry, but I must disagree. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Constitution is still a very common save (poison, cold, fatigue/exhaustion) and although people might not strive to make it a 2nd or 3rd highest score, I doubt many people would dump in it. That being said, the tables I play at very rarely ever see dump stats. The ONLY time any PC in any group I have ever played 5E with had a dump stat it was my female elven cleric/rogue/wizard with a STR 9. I know it seems to be more common in other groups, if people are happy to dump STR, INT, or CHA (the most common because they are weak saves by comparison), but I can't help what other groups do.As it is, CON is the highest average ability IME (with DEX being a VERY close second), and RAW this is pretty much only because it is linked to HP. By removing that link, CON can fall to a more even keel with the other scores. DEX (as most of us know) is the king of ability scores, but that is due mostly to finesse weapons IMO. shrug(bold added)That is the point for the change. And FWIW if you read my other posts, you would know I mention removing CON bonus hp from creatures as well, cutting their (on average) hp to about 60-65% of normal overall IIRC.As far as barbarians, et al. are concerned, again this in intentional. With 200+ hp (and resistance via rage) barbarians become nearly impossible to kill unless the DM wants to target them directly or have (even) deadly encounters go overboard.By reducing hp maximum, it makes weaker creatures a greater threat, allowing the DM a greater latitude of creatures to chose from when designing encounters. Also, it forces players to play more tactfully instead of always taking a heads-on approach.Yep, completely intentional for players (and DMs) who want to remove the hp bloat along with other issues. Yes, it applies to creatures as well as PCs. I've considered the impact very carefully (for literally months now of play testing) and a point you neglected is magic. Spells become more powerful when hp are lower. This generally favors PCs as their magic will be more impactful, but since magic-using creatures are common enough, it can also work against them.Finally, FWIW, when we removed CON modifier as bonus hp, we added a new use for it: Endurance, which allows you to "absorb" or "negate" a level of exhaustion equal to your CON modifier. Given critical hits (at one point) also caused a level of exhaustion, this was a very good incentive to have a decent CON still if you wanted it. When we recently played RotFM, where PCs were gaining exhaustion due to the cold, endurance was (literally) a life saver more than once.While I appreciate your points, yes these changes are geared towards making the game more lethal and in many ways, more realistic. I understand fully that style of play does not appeal to many, but we like it. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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