Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mercurius" data-source="post: 5349194" data-attributes="member: 59082">Celebrim, Beginning of the End covered a lot of points I would have made but I'll reply to what you wrote.   Yes, that was you and that was (mainly) me, but as BotE pointed out, not only is there another way of entering the game--buying a book and learning how to play on one's own--but WotC can't rely on just word of mouth to grow the game. Why? Because it hasn't worked. Well, it has worked to some degree but it is largely out of the hands of WotC - all they can do is make the best product they can and try to attract new buyers.So yes, some people do start playing an RPG by buying the books. Or maybe they re-start playing by buying a book, like the new Red Box. A lapsed AD&D player who hasn't played for twenty years is basically a new player and would have to re-learn the game. Don't you think WotC is trying to re-connect with this "lost generation" of players--mainly Gen-Xers--that hasn't played since they (we) Grew Up? Think of how many people played D&D in the early to mid 80s; there must be millions of 30-50 year olds who haven't played since junior high or high school; say, hypothetically, that there are 10 million people that played D&D in the 80s that haven't played since. It isn't about trying to get those 10 million back, but what about 1% of them? One in a hundred of that "lost generation" and you've got 100,000 new players.The point being, if you are WotC you are looking at multiple markets; here is what comes to mind, off-hand:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Existing 4E players</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Friends of existing 4E players</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Existing players of other editions of D&D/Pathfinder</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Existing players of other RPGs</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Lapsed players who have played within the last decade (3.x era)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Lapsed players who haven't played in 10+ years</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Lapsed players who haven't played in 20+ years</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">People who have never played D&D</li> </ul>That is probably not an exhaustive list but my point is that different markets require different marketing strategies, and that doesn't even take into account "sub-markets." For instance, existing players of other editions of D&D - the 3.5 crowd is different from the Old School crowd; or with regards to people who have never played, there are artsy types, nerdy types, theater types, etc. Which goes back to the OP and the perceived need to have an easier entry point, easier character generation, and a generally less "stat heavy" variant of the game, at least as an introduction.It doesn't take away the fact that many--even most--people learn from experienced gamers. But there are other ways to enter the game, and and a wide variety of people (and markets to be targeted) that might enjoy playing.Rules lite games are not, in my experience and opinion, about "making up new rules" as they are applying judgment and imagination. The same goes for my experience at my job; it isn't about making up a rule on the fly as much as it is using my judgment within a given situation and taking into account context and the specifics of the situation. Certainly I have experienced many situations where not having a clear rule has made things a bit fuzzy, but on the other hand if one has a rule for every possible situation it ends up being overly complicated and divorced from reality. In other words, it becomes a massive abstract bureaucracy that misses the people that it is meant to serve.But when I am talking about a simpler version of D&D I am not talking about an "ultra-lite" game like FATE or ORE. I am talking about something more light-to-medium, and in contrast with the "rules heavy" 3.5 and the "rules medium-to-heavy" 4E. Furthermore, and more to a point, a well designed light-to-medium game can cover most situations quite adequately. For example, let's say that this so-called Basic 4E did away with skills and replaced them with Ability checks. If you are trying to walk across a tightrope you very simply use your DEX mod + half level and that's that. Maybe each class gets a bonus to different ability checks, so for example a Rogue might get a bonus to DEX checks and a wizard a bonus to INT checks. Etc. The point being, you do away with the added complication (or module) of specific skills, but a character can still do anything they want, it just falls under the purview of ability scores.Yes, exactly. This is why I've been emphasizing modularity, over and over again, and why I'd like to see at least a differentiation between a stripped-down Basic game and an Advanced set of modular rules. Everyone plays the Basic game but what modules each DM uses may vary. (I really should just sit down and work out a Basic 4E; I don't even know how it would look and have only thought about it in relation to these discussions, never actually tried to formulate it; hmm....)</blockquote>

Verification