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<blockquote data-quote="jim pinto" data-source="post: 4712473" data-attributes="member: 17619"><p>Thanks for the response Firelance. If even 1% of this…</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>… is true, then I can only assume you and I come from very very very different schools of thought about gaming. I can't imagine we game the same way or for that matter, play the same games. If my assumption is false, I apologize, but I recognize there are styles of play that I just do not encounter anymore in my travels.</p><p></p><p>We're unlikely to agree on this point of GM-less games because,</p><p></p><p>a. I don't game like you</p><p>b. You are comfortable doing what you do and don't want to change</p><p>c. There's a misunderstanding (because I'm not explaining myself well) that I think you're doing it wrong</p><p></p><p>That's not an attack. That's a statement of fact. D&D isn't my game of choice anymore, so my opinion here is even less valid than it used to be.</p><p></p><p>Taking the workload off the GM is only a portion of my point. The mentality that "I didn't enjoy this game because of the GM" is so rampant in this hobby (and such a fallacy among gamers) to even bring it up as ludicrous causes people's heads to spin. If the GM was bad, what did you do as a player to fix it? Can you even imagine playing D&D without a GM? Can you imagine a game world without XP or treasure? Do players really sit down for Diablo because it captures High Fantasy Heroism or because the monsters puke out treasure?</p><p></p><p>I'm well-aware that 99% of gamers do not agree with me on this point of a GM free of the burden of being the entertainer. But I won't stop me from believing that enough symptoms of gaming exist because of the main fallacy/diseases that plague D&D:</p><p></p><p>1. GM is here to entertain</p><p>2. XP is the only way for me to develop my character</p><p>3. US vs. Them (the GM is also the enemy)</p><p> which leads to a subset disease, the GM stops me from winning</p><p>4. Cooperation vs. Competition (when did teamwork disappear)</p><p>5. Class/Skill systems are superior to Class/Skill systems</p><p></p><p>This tangent has gone on long enough for me to say, I should either drop it or bring it to a new thread. I don't read enworld all that much, and I'm not sure if this topic has ever come up before. But, if you want to make D&D more accessible and more viable as a product in the 21st century… find a way to make it zero-prep and GM-friendly and more people will be playing it. It's competing against the greatest zero-prep game of all time, WoW. And while that phrase may spark a riot, I'm trying to make a point, not inflame people that are already upset.</p><p></p><p>Sorry for the tangent.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="jim pinto, post: 4712473, member: 17619"] Thanks for the response Firelance. If even 1% of this… … is true, then I can only assume you and I come from very very very different schools of thought about gaming. I can't imagine we game the same way or for that matter, play the same games. If my assumption is false, I apologize, but I recognize there are styles of play that I just do not encounter anymore in my travels. We're unlikely to agree on this point of GM-less games because, a. I don't game like you b. You are comfortable doing what you do and don't want to change c. There's a misunderstanding (because I'm not explaining myself well) that I think you're doing it wrong That's not an attack. That's a statement of fact. D&D isn't my game of choice anymore, so my opinion here is even less valid than it used to be. Taking the workload off the GM is only a portion of my point. The mentality that "I didn't enjoy this game because of the GM" is so rampant in this hobby (and such a fallacy among gamers) to even bring it up as ludicrous causes people's heads to spin. If the GM was bad, what did you do as a player to fix it? Can you even imagine playing D&D without a GM? Can you imagine a game world without XP or treasure? Do players really sit down for Diablo because it captures High Fantasy Heroism or because the monsters puke out treasure? I'm well-aware that 99% of gamers do not agree with me on this point of a GM free of the burden of being the entertainer. But I won't stop me from believing that enough symptoms of gaming exist because of the main fallacy/diseases that plague D&D: 1. GM is here to entertain 2. XP is the only way for me to develop my character 3. US vs. Them (the GM is also the enemy) which leads to a subset disease, the GM stops me from winning 4. Cooperation vs. Competition (when did teamwork disappear) 5. Class/Skill systems are superior to Class/Skill systems This tangent has gone on long enough for me to say, I should either drop it or bring it to a new thread. I don't read enworld all that much, and I'm not sure if this topic has ever come up before. But, if you want to make D&D more accessible and more viable as a product in the 21st century… find a way to make it zero-prep and GM-friendly and more people will be playing it. It's competing against the greatest zero-prep game of all time, WoW. And while that phrase may spark a riot, I'm trying to make a point, not inflame people that are already upset. Sorry for the tangent. [/QUOTE]
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