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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GMforPowergamers" data-source="post: 8633297" data-attributes="member: 67338">I will chicken in the egg this... Paizo (again they had to eat I understand, and wotc put out the ogl then tried to abandon it so there bad) and the PF crowd were VERY vocal and in some cases still are (It's all magic, everyone regrows lost limbs every night, you can shout someone back from the dead).  I compare it to a youtube  channel CinamaSins... they are a couple guys that make fun of movies (if you find them funny is up to you) but they blew up to have millions of viewers... and they took the jokes serious. So then people repeated the joke as critisms. then people who heard that critisism repeated it again... soon it looped around and people who don't watch and have no idea what the channel is said it to someone who liked the channel. When that happened it reinforced that it MUST be right because people without seeing it new it. The same way I see debunked movie complaints repeated without knowing where it came from, I see with 4e (and other things it isn't just them) it is a memification of complaints.In my experience day 1 didn't bring them all back. However it DID bring back alot by going back to 3e styles (and adjusting for the meme complaints) However as pathfinder aged more people looked to new things (like every edition) and when PF went 2e a big influx to 5e happened when if you were changing anyway...</blockquote>