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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 5000112" data-attributes="member: 22779">How does this conflict with what I said.&nbsp; Just because two characters are mechanically identical does not mean that they have the same role.&nbsp; One could have an entirely different personality than the other.&nbsp; Role assumption assumes that they will and an RPG assumes that you will choose to play your character differently.&nbsp; And that this difference will come out during play.There is no way to make a persona affect how I play Monopoly.&nbsp; And certainly nothing in Monopoly presumes that I will change my persona in any way in order to play.Abstract does not mean imaginary.&nbsp; While I agree that abstraction can be used to determine narrative events, they have to be an abstraction of something.&nbsp; If there are no literal events to depict, how can you have any sort of narrative.&nbsp; While I can abstract a combat scene using all sorts of mechanics, that abstraction still maps onto a narrative, logically consistent scene.&nbsp; You cannot have that in Monopoly.Again, I claim shenanigans here.&nbsp; &quot;Go outside and you die&quot; is effectively the same as not allowing you to go outside.&nbsp; If you go outside, you are ejected from the game.&nbsp; How is that not a prohibition?I would argue that there is no difference here.&nbsp; &quot;If you go outside in daylight, you may no longer play this game&quot; is no different than, &quot;If you don't want to play this game, quit&quot;.&nbsp; The player always has the choice to not play.&nbsp; How is there any difference from kicking the table and knocking over all the chess pieces and &quot;if you do this you cannot play anymore&quot;?In any game, you always have the choice to not play.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 5000112, member: 22779"] How does this conflict with what I said. Just because two characters are mechanically identical does not mean that they have the same role. One could have an entirely different personality than the other. Role assumption assumes that they will and an RPG assumes that you will choose to play your character differently. And that this difference will come out during play. There is no way to make a persona affect how I play Monopoly. And certainly nothing in Monopoly presumes that I will change my persona in any way in order to play. Abstract does not mean imaginary. While I agree that abstraction can be used to determine narrative events, they have to be an abstraction of something. If there are no literal events to depict, how can you have any sort of narrative. While I can abstract a combat scene using all sorts of mechanics, that abstraction still maps onto a narrative, logically consistent scene. You cannot have that in Monopoly. Again, I claim shenanigans here. "Go outside and you die" is effectively the same as not allowing you to go outside. If you go outside, you are ejected from the game. How is that not a prohibition? I would argue that there is no difference here. "If you go outside in daylight, you may no longer play this game" is no different than, "If you don't want to play this game, quit". The player always has the choice to not play. How is there any difference from kicking the table and knocking over all the chess pieces and "if you do this you cannot play anymore"? In any game, you always have the choice to not play. [/QUOTE]

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