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<blockquote data-quote="Jeff Carlsen" data-source="post: 6036292" data-attributes="member: 61749"><p>My definition isn't entirely based on the name, but on D&D history. There are thirty years of energy drain being a permanent weakening of a character. It's part of the story and setting. </p><p></p><p>Can there be a non-permanent option or similar but non-permanent ability? Certainly. Many groups would prefer to use those. But the default option should reflect the game's history.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Spellcasting in D&D is magic as a supernatural force. You could argue that it's a natural force in the context of the setting, but it still does things that are otherwise impossible. Regardless, we're arguing semantics. My real point is that energy drain, like amputation or death, is permanent. That is, unless you consider magic, in which case anything can be potentially reversed. In this case, the traditional method is with the <em>restoration</em> spell.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I honestly don't think that the default baseline has to be this. D&D went three decades without this as the baseline. Now, I don't believe that the default options need to be the harshest, but neither should they be the most forgiving. The default mechanics should reasonably express the in-world effects they describe. You can't do that and not have permanent or long lasting effects.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You're right. I made assumptions. I'm trying to understand why you would have a problem with this. The fact that some debilitating conditions would be permanent makes sense, as does the idea that magic might be able to restore those conditions. </p><p></p><p>To some extent, I understand that it's dull to have the players just run off to hire a cleric, but that's more of a problem with the availability of consequence free divine magic, a problem that already has wide-reaching detrimental effects on the setting.</p><p></p><p>Spirit healing itself quickly doesn't fit well with human culture. Our myths, stories, and even day to day metaphors are filled with examples of spiritual wounds that don't heal easily if at all. At our most optimistic, the phrase is "time heals all wounds," and we're not referring to an extended rest.</p><p></p><p>All of that said, your idea of having to kill the monster has merit, depending on the monster. Some monsters should consume drained energy for temporary power, in which case killing the monster to get it back doesn't really make sense. Others, though, might hold the energy and gain permanent power. In these cases, it makes absolute sense that killing the monster could free the energy. </p><p></p><p></p><p>* * *</p><p></p><p>Overall, what I'm saying is that a permanent form of energy drain belongs in the default assumptions of the setting for a variety of reasons, and thus should be the default rule.</p><p></p><p>I also believe that optional recovery mechanics should be presented. One of those options is to have the effects go away after a long rest. It might be cool for there to be rules for spiritual recovery through revenge, or healing through meditation and prayer.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jeff Carlsen, post: 6036292, member: 61749"] My definition isn't entirely based on the name, but on D&D history. There are thirty years of energy drain being a permanent weakening of a character. It's part of the story and setting. Can there be a non-permanent option or similar but non-permanent ability? Certainly. Many groups would prefer to use those. But the default option should reflect the game's history. Spellcasting in D&D is magic as a supernatural force. You could argue that it's a natural force in the context of the setting, but it still does things that are otherwise impossible. Regardless, we're arguing semantics. My real point is that energy drain, like amputation or death, is permanent. That is, unless you consider magic, in which case anything can be potentially reversed. In this case, the traditional method is with the [I]restoration[/I] spell. I honestly don't think that the default baseline has to be this. D&D went three decades without this as the baseline. Now, I don't believe that the default options need to be the harshest, but neither should they be the most forgiving. The default mechanics should reasonably express the in-world effects they describe. You can't do that and not have permanent or long lasting effects. You're right. I made assumptions. I'm trying to understand why you would have a problem with this. The fact that some debilitating conditions would be permanent makes sense, as does the idea that magic might be able to restore those conditions. To some extent, I understand that it's dull to have the players just run off to hire a cleric, but that's more of a problem with the availability of consequence free divine magic, a problem that already has wide-reaching detrimental effects on the setting. Spirit healing itself quickly doesn't fit well with human culture. Our myths, stories, and even day to day metaphors are filled with examples of spiritual wounds that don't heal easily if at all. At our most optimistic, the phrase is "time heals all wounds," and we're not referring to an extended rest. All of that said, your idea of having to kill the monster has merit, depending on the monster. Some monsters should consume drained energy for temporary power, in which case killing the monster to get it back doesn't really make sense. Others, though, might hold the energy and gain permanent power. In these cases, it makes absolute sense that killing the monster could free the energy. * * * Overall, what I'm saying is that a permanent form of energy drain belongs in the default assumptions of the setting for a variety of reasons, and thus should be the default rule. I also believe that optional recovery mechanics should be presented. One of those options is to have the effects go away after a long rest. It might be cool for there to be rules for spiritual recovery through revenge, or healing through meditation and prayer. [/QUOTE]
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