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<blockquote data-quote="AtomicPope" data-source="post: 4207629" data-attributes="member: 64790">So you're saying that a DM should make NPC's that are just as powerful as the worst Min/Maxed characters possible right?If players are supposed to be uber rules monkeys then DM's should do the exact same thing.&nbsp; After all, D&amp;D by your very interpretation is competative.&nbsp; So when a GM makes an Incantrix Wizard Mindflayer that deals 60d6 of untyped damage to the party every round while under a Superior Invisibility spell that's cool.&nbsp; Never mind that even the worst min/maxed parties cannot survive this.&nbsp; It's competition.The problem with low-brow, superficial assessments is they don't realize that the DM can use the exact same tools to build monsters in 3e.&nbsp; People that don't DM never bother to figure out how CR is calculated.&nbsp; They just say, out of hand, it's competition.&nbsp; Well maybe it is competition, but it's also broken.&nbsp; One fact doesn't changed the other.&nbsp; They're not mutually exclusive.&nbsp; In 3e it's so easy for any DM that can min/max to TPK a party by building a rival NPC party to fight.&nbsp; The CR is legit.&nbsp; The rules are legit.&nbsp; Everything is according to the game.&nbsp; But the PC's will lose because it's about all about the opening round when uber min/maxed classes are involved.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AtomicPope, post: 4207629, member: 64790"] So you're saying that a DM should make NPC's that are just as powerful as the worst Min/Maxed characters possible right? If players are supposed to be uber rules monkeys then DM's should do the exact same thing. After all, D&D by your very interpretation is competative. So when a GM makes an Incantrix Wizard Mindflayer that deals 60d6 of untyped damage to the party every round while under a Superior Invisibility spell that's cool. Never mind that even the worst min/maxed parties cannot survive this. It's competition. The problem with low-brow, superficial assessments is they don't realize that the DM can use the [I]exact [/I] same tools to build monsters in 3e. People that don't DM never bother to figure out how CR is calculated. They just say, out of hand, it's competition. Well maybe it is competition, but it's also broken. One fact doesn't changed the other. They're not mutually exclusive. In 3e it's so easy for any DM that can min/max to TPK a party by building a rival NPC party to fight. The CR is legit. The rules are legit. Everything is according to the game. But the PC's will lose because it's about all about the opening round when uber min/maxed classes are involved. [/QUOTE]

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