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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Will the OGL fiasco increase third party support for Pathfinder?
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<blockquote data-quote="Kichwas" data-source="post: 8952631" data-attributes="member: 891"><p>Maybe not from FLGS'. But I'm not convinced that's the important metric.</p><p></p><p>I haven't really used local shops since the early 2000s. I can't be alone in that.</p><p></p><p>The thing about all these people buying PF2E right now is that they're still doing it. That Humble Bundle is flying off the digital shelves.</p><p></p><p>If you go on Roll20 - "nobody" is looking for or offering PF2E games. But not because it's dead, because that's a bad place to look - it's poorly implemented there. Flip over to Discord and there are groups looking for players to play on Foundry or Discord or pretty much anywhere but Roll20 that often fill out a whole table in minutes.</p><p></p><p>Right now the big issue is a shortage of GMs.</p><p></p><p>People "just got" the books - a pattern I see repeated over and over on Discord is "hey I just got PF2E and am going to run a game if anyone's interested" followed by some 20 responses before I can even manage to get my fingers to my keyboard.</p><p></p><p>If someone says "hey I just got PF2E and am looking for a game to join" they get met with that 'cowboy movie noise' as a tumbleweed rolls by across their screen because there's just not enough GMs.</p><p></p><p>In person would make sense to be even worse. At a local shop you're always pulling from a smaller pool of people - and until one of the GMs out there feels comfortable running a game, it's gonna be tumbleweeds rolling across the table. Local shops can't compete against folks buying the Humble Bundle or wanting to 'support the ORC' by buying direct.</p><p></p><p>For the end consumer it is smarter to buy PF2E direct from Paizo with the subscription - you get a PDF and print book for just the copy of a print book. So PF2E buyers start to appear to 'vanish' from the perspective of local stores. I know a lot of people would consider that a bad move on Paizo's part. Maybe it is, but I got it anyway. Better than buying off Amazon, and I've not had the 'local shop' option in a few decades.</p><p></p><p>I don't think PF2E's yesterday's game. I see discussion of it all over the Internet, albeit not much here - which is kind of why I've not been tempted to return to this site for some time. The fandom here is moving one way and I'm moving another and right now we're in a brief moment of PF2E hype that has us intersecting but I will probably blow away with the next rush of Tumbleweeds. Not for any reason against folks here. Just this isn't the hangout spot for Pathfinder players.</p><p></p><p>I don't think PF2E has any chance right now of dethroning D&D again. It might once OneD&D hits - all depends on what that ends up being. But right now too many D&D folks would prefer to pretend the last 2 months didn't happen, because their current game still meets their needs.</p><p></p><p>BUT I don't think PF2E is suffering. Six months ago I might have thought so, but not now. A lot of people, even fans like me, had a misinformed impression of the game thanks to a select few YouTubers, and that really hurt the game. But now it's in 100,000 more hands that it was just a few days ago, and people are ramping up to play it.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Third Party folks will notice numbers like that, so books will start showing up there as well. Though maybe most of them will be sold as PDFs only.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kichwas, post: 8952631, member: 891"] Maybe not from FLGS'. But I'm not convinced that's the important metric. I haven't really used local shops since the early 2000s. I can't be alone in that. The thing about all these people buying PF2E right now is that they're still doing it. That Humble Bundle is flying off the digital shelves. If you go on Roll20 - "nobody" is looking for or offering PF2E games. But not because it's dead, because that's a bad place to look - it's poorly implemented there. Flip over to Discord and there are groups looking for players to play on Foundry or Discord or pretty much anywhere but Roll20 that often fill out a whole table in minutes. Right now the big issue is a shortage of GMs. People "just got" the books - a pattern I see repeated over and over on Discord is "hey I just got PF2E and am going to run a game if anyone's interested" followed by some 20 responses before I can even manage to get my fingers to my keyboard. If someone says "hey I just got PF2E and am looking for a game to join" they get met with that 'cowboy movie noise' as a tumbleweed rolls by across their screen because there's just not enough GMs. In person would make sense to be even worse. At a local shop you're always pulling from a smaller pool of people - and until one of the GMs out there feels comfortable running a game, it's gonna be tumbleweeds rolling across the table. Local shops can't compete against folks buying the Humble Bundle or wanting to 'support the ORC' by buying direct. For the end consumer it is smarter to buy PF2E direct from Paizo with the subscription - you get a PDF and print book for just the copy of a print book. So PF2E buyers start to appear to 'vanish' from the perspective of local stores. I know a lot of people would consider that a bad move on Paizo's part. Maybe it is, but I got it anyway. Better than buying off Amazon, and I've not had the 'local shop' option in a few decades. I don't think PF2E's yesterday's game. I see discussion of it all over the Internet, albeit not much here - which is kind of why I've not been tempted to return to this site for some time. The fandom here is moving one way and I'm moving another and right now we're in a brief moment of PF2E hype that has us intersecting but I will probably blow away with the next rush of Tumbleweeds. Not for any reason against folks here. Just this isn't the hangout spot for Pathfinder players. I don't think PF2E has any chance right now of dethroning D&D again. It might once OneD&D hits - all depends on what that ends up being. But right now too many D&D folks would prefer to pretend the last 2 months didn't happen, because their current game still meets their needs. BUT I don't think PF2E is suffering. Six months ago I might have thought so, but not now. A lot of people, even fans like me, had a misinformed impression of the game thanks to a select few YouTubers, and that really hurt the game. But now it's in 100,000 more hands that it was just a few days ago, and people are ramping up to play it. Third Party folks will notice numbers like that, so books will start showing up there as well. Though maybe most of them will be sold as PDFs only. [/QUOTE]
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