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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Senior Bobo" data-source="post: 1329522" data-attributes="member: 12675">I agree with the others.  The idea is that a Miracle is granted by your patron power who you've been serving presumably faithful for 17+ levels now.   Also, what you can ask for is generally limited by the power you follow.A LG Wizard can, in extreme circumstances, wish to temporarily raise an entire graveyard full of undead to go combat some great evil.A Cleric of a god dedicated against undead just isn't gonna have that happen with a Miracle.In the end, it's like all other RP penalties.  If the DM chooses not to enforce it, then it's not really a penalty and it's out of balance.  To me it makes sense from a 'logical' point of view that miracles are more divine then arcane and should be easier for clerics.This triggered a bad flashback of the last time I ever used a wish in a game.  I have to share.I was playing a level 15 warrior / cavalier type in a 2ed game.  As part of the backstory I was tasked with protecting the lives of 2 of the other party members.  After a huge encounter with a leiutenant of a BBEG we lived, but my Sun Blade Bastard Sword (named Glory) was disarmed from me and then summarily teleported without error into the Abyss.   We did, however, find on the bad guy a ring with 2 wishes.The friendly wizard npc, obviously speaking for the dm, immediately notes that I could use a wish to get my sword back.   I, however, took the loss in stride and announced I was going to go find a decent, nonmagical, bastard sword and we could continue without it, claiming that I'd rather save the 2 wishes to bring back the people under my protection should something bad happen to them.  I thought I was being very selfless and all.For 15 minutes the other players, and finally the dm, essentially demanded I use one wish to get my sword back, claiming I'd need it, saying I wasn't rp'ing properly even. (These people were seriously item focused).  The DM was adamant that I use the wish essentially stating that's the entire reason why he put the ring there.   They finally annoyed me to the point I said "Fine.  I wish to have Glory returned to me!"I swear as God is my witness, the dm looked at me, shook his head and said "Well, ok, if that's your wish.  A bard arrives on the scene and begins following you around, singing of your accomplishments and bringing glory to the party."We don't talk anymore.Now that was a ring, and didn't cost xp.  In 3rd edition if I, or another party member, had spend 5000 xp and had that happen?  That would've been grounds for acquittal right there.  All I'd have needed was one gamer on the jury.Don't anyone be that DM, please.</blockquote>

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