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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Wish vs. Miracle
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<blockquote data-quote="Otterscrubber" data-source="post: 1329702" data-attributes="member: 4588"><p>IMHO, DMs who cling to monkey paw wishes need to get with the times. Previously wishes were very unstructured and DMs were encouraged to mess with players who asked for things that were unbalanced or out of line to keep some sort of balance. This is continued in 3e and 3.5, but at least there is some structure now as to what should be safe to cast. But along the way somehow this got twisted into "If your players are dumb enough to cast this spell they deserve what they get!" </p><p></p><p>Now if you are getting a wish from a Glabrezu demon I can see how your simple, altruistic wish to resurrect your friend might not have the happy ending you envisioned, but other than that I think DMs need to remember this is a 9th level spell that should be working FOR the PC, not against him/her.</p><p></p><p>Now are far as Miracles being a better deal than wishes I am troubled that everyone seems to think deities are less vindictive/demanding than whatever force magic springs from. With regards to arcane magic, it seems to be pretty neutral when casting all the other spells, why would this one be different? I think that in an Fantasy RPG like D&D you can ratinalize anything so saying that the gods are easier to deal with does not make sense to me. Neither does an arguement that wizards are more flexible than clerics that someone mentioned. You do know that clerics have access to ALL of their spells while wizards generally don't? How that is more flexible I would like to know.</p><p></p><p>Sounds like there is a game imbalance so far. Too bad, as it is unlikely to get addressed or even properly explained at this point.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Otterscrubber, post: 1329702, member: 4588"] IMHO, DMs who cling to monkey paw wishes need to get with the times. Previously wishes were very unstructured and DMs were encouraged to mess with players who asked for things that were unbalanced or out of line to keep some sort of balance. This is continued in 3e and 3.5, but at least there is some structure now as to what should be safe to cast. But along the way somehow this got twisted into "If your players are dumb enough to cast this spell they deserve what they get!" Now if you are getting a wish from a Glabrezu demon I can see how your simple, altruistic wish to resurrect your friend might not have the happy ending you envisioned, but other than that I think DMs need to remember this is a 9th level spell that should be working FOR the PC, not against him/her. Now are far as Miracles being a better deal than wishes I am troubled that everyone seems to think deities are less vindictive/demanding than whatever force magic springs from. With regards to arcane magic, it seems to be pretty neutral when casting all the other spells, why would this one be different? I think that in an Fantasy RPG like D&D you can ratinalize anything so saying that the gods are easier to deal with does not make sense to me. Neither does an arguement that wizards are more flexible than clerics that someone mentioned. You do know that clerics have access to ALL of their spells while wizards generally don't? How that is more flexible I would like to know. Sounds like there is a game imbalance so far. Too bad, as it is unlikely to get addressed or even properly explained at this point. [/QUOTE]
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Wish vs. Miracle
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