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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Xavim" data-source="post: 1148828" data-attributes="member: 14089">Theres two ways of looking at this.  Low level play, and high level play.  And because I don't play Sorcerers (I hate the lack of versitility) I'm comparing Clerics and Wizards.Low Level: 1st - 4th (i'm going to be mainly focusing on 1st)Everyone knows which characters need to be babied at first level and more often then not are nearly killed instantly by a stray arrow or what not.  The arcane.  There isn't a party of adventurers out there that can't tell you a story or two about how they had to protect the wizard from some sword wielding calamity.  When was the last time you heard people worrying about their cleric?  With the clerics ability to cast all of thier spells in armour, he/she gains that huge survivability factor everyone's raving about, while the wizard, needs to spend all of his first level allotment of spells on defence just to save his hide.  Mage armour + Shield uses up most wizard's spell power completely unless their ability scores are out of control.  The only way an arcane spellcaster can stand their own is through liberal use of their scribe scroll ability.  Without, they're just a little kid waiting to grow up.  The cleric's offence stands up pretty well at these levels aswell.  With a decent amount of hp, BAB, saves and such they can hold their own pretty well.  Heavy armour and a really big shield make them nearly indistinguishable from the early fighter.  Even the Druid wins over the Arcane spellcaster in this regard.Conclusion: Divine spellcaster stronger.High Level: 20thI'm considering things at 20th because, lets face it, if you want to determine which spellcasters are the 'best' you need to consider it at its 'best'.  (I'm not getting into epic levels simply because it would just be a continuation of what I'm about to say anyway)  You show me something (at CR20) that can stand up to a 20th level wizard.  There isn't anything.  In high levels there is no equal for the Wizard.  At this stage of the game the character can do anything, and cast anything.  Wish and other such spells allows the character to cast as many heal spells as he chooses aswell as giving the character access to any spell of 6th level or lower on ANY spell list.  With the wizards ability to craft magical items, he can quickly become a better healer than the cleric himself.  A couple Rods/staves of healing in a bag of holding ought to keep those fighters standing for a while.  While this is contrasted by the Clerical Miracle, Miracle is restricted in that its success/failure depends on the attitudes of a third party and cannot be used for any purpose contrary to the goals of your diety.  Spell research allows the Wizard to easily and effectively bypass any difficulty.  Fighters need healing?  Create a spell that gives him regeneration.  A party laced with Contingency : Teleport spells would be impossible to kill without increadable anti-magic countermeasures.  The Wizard character by this time has had ample opportunity to purchase any combat feats they may require.  I'm a big fan of Still spell, and Heavy armour.  Whenever I play Sorcerers (which is rare) they all do this trick.  For a slight reduction in spell power, I now as armoured as any fighter and still can apply all of my spells to maximum effect.The sheer power of spells such as meteor swarm, Wail of the Banshee, and the invincible Prismatic Sphere clearly show the wizard as being the dominant character class.  Wizards also can create golems, monsters, and simulectrums to bolster the party.  Its entirely possible that the enemy cleric would have to face multiple copies of the Wizard all at once.  The cleric doesn't have anything that can come close.All of the most powerful spells are in the wizards possession.  The wizard possesses enough HP that he can take some hits that somehow manage to penatrate his defences.  And if he doesn't have the hp, he can Magic Jar his pet Storm Giant to make use of its hp instead.  Try getting a better 'buffing' benefit than that.</blockquote>

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