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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Scott Christian" data-source="post: 9183215" data-attributes="member: 6901101">It is the heart of the disagreement here, I just happen to not only believe are wizards and fighters equal at contributing to a group, I believe they are equal even with only one fight per long rest. In combat, the fighter shines sometimes and the wizard shines sometimes. Our session last night, the wizard was kind of worthless. The big-bad had magic resistance and a few legendary actions that negated the wizard outright. And the wizard would have been the first to fall had my character not offered a surrender. In essence, the wizard did nothing. Oh, and on the way there, the ranger had the spotlight and was the one to get us out of the jams. Each time, there was a fully rested wizard. (The prior fight, the wizard dazed a few creatures and my fighter sliced both up. Teamwork - yea!)In the end it boils down to the table. My fighter contributes just as much (if not more than) the other characters during RP. My fighter explores just as much too. This has been true for every table I have ever played at for 5e, which is five across three states. All in person. And while all of this is circumstantial, others on here keep saying the same thing. This is why, when we disagree, I actually think it is the DMs fault. Maybe they do not know how to set up a variety of encounters that highlights different classes? Maybe they don't know how the RP sessions and exploration sessions inside the game are supposed to work? I don't know what it is, but I know my experiences have been consistent - the fighter shines just as much as the other classes. One caveat: I know I keep putting caveats in, but this is one I have not seen discussed, and I think it is worth mentioning. Not everyone is a good player. And some players have a certain personality that lends themselves to certain classes. This can make the waters mirky. And when you sit that player next to a great player, the water can turn to mud. Picture a strong roleplayer with a pedantic grasp of the rules playing a wizard. Now picture a player that is a weak roleplayer, weak grasp of the rules, playing a fighter. Put them at the same table and I could possibly see coming to the conclusion that fighters need to be changed. That is, of course, until I saw the player play a different class.  I know you didn't mean it as derogatory. I didn't take it as such. I was just trying to point out the difference, at least how I see it. I do 100% agree with you though. It is filtered through the DM, and there are DMs that handle it terribly. (I know I have mentioned this, but I have run several D&D clubs for different high schools. At that age, there are so many other things at play at the table, the DMs often make very poor decisions, despite the players being creative and really intelligent at times. So I have seen what you are talking about.)</blockquote>

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