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Message: <blockquote data-quote="solates" data-source="post: 2679779" data-attributes="member: 38046">The issue here is gear.lvl 20 characters should have about 760,000 gp in gear.A wizard is going to blow most of his on scrolls, staves, rods, armor increasing items(bracers of armor +9, gloves of dex +6, amulet of natural armor +6, ring of protection +5).and any intelligence increasing items(headband of intellect +6).A monk however is going for saves(cloak of resistance +5) and the same above except he probably will get a belt of giant strength as well and instead of amulet of natural armor a phylactery of wisdom +6.  And all the above as well. Difference is basicly that a monk has no bad saves, has leap of the clouds(and with 23 ranks + say 3 for str mod is 26 + d20 roll for jumping) massive speed(made better with a simple set of boots of striding and jumping).  He also has abundant step(dimension door) 1/day.And he has the diamond soul ability(which at lvl 20 would be sr 30 meaning the wizard would have to roll 10 or higher everytime he cast a spell to have it affect the monk, or 6 or higher if he had burned 2 feats to get greater spell penetration).Getting to the wizard is not an actual issue-a monk can close distance without issue, OR he could just sneak up on the wizard.  There is no spell that reveals a hidden character.  This gives him a surprise round.  And most likely the wizard will start his round flat on his back.  Which means among other things he will spend the rest of the fight trying to get up.And saying he does have contigency for 50% hp(normal contingency) all that does is get him away from the fight, he goes away, buffs, comes back flying etc.. The monk can simply just hide and wait for a new opportunity to gank the wizard.Simply put any character with a high hide skill can kill anyone without spot as a class skill. This starts at 1st lvl when a ranger, rogue, monk starts using hit and run tactics to win against overwhelming opposition.  The way it works is legit, but extremely one sided, unless you have someone who can spot the enemy the enemy will eventually win.Also only a small handful of wizard spells do not allow a save, and most are touch, or ranged touch attacks, both of which are pretty much NOT going to hit a monk because his ac and touch ac are pretty much the same(minus bracers of armor and amulet of natural armor if he does have them, most give up the natural armor for the wisdom boost).If the environment allows for stealth the monk will win.  IF it does not the monk will still most likely win IF he has boots of flying in his backpack and takes the round to change footwear.  OR he has a potion of flying(best bet).A high lvl character is dangerous but only against certain enemies, a monk is really designed to take out soft targets and make hard targets work for the kill.  A wizard is in general designed to handle utility spells among the party and take out enemy hard targets but starts to lose steam when he comes accross anything with evasion, improved evasion and good saves.The two classes that really work well against a wizard are rogues, and monks.  A rogue can hit and run a wizard to death in no time, and a monk can just literally take a wizard out without much issue in one round or 2. Solates</blockquote>

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