Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Wizard vs. Sorcerer for Newbie
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="bret" data-source="post: 486840" data-attributes="member: 713"><p>Part of the problem is by 6th level, the player has too many spells in their spellbook for a newbie to pick up.</p><p></p><p>At a guess, the minimum values would be:</p><p>1st: 8 (6 to start, +2 as 2nd)</p><p>2nd 4</p><p>3rd 4</p><p></p><p></p><p>The wizard has probably picked up more from other sources. Probably only a couple of 3rd level, half-dozen at most of 2nd level, and maybe eight or so first level spells. Depends on the GM.</p><p></p><p>I agree that making a special spellbook for the player would help a lot. So would having a familiar that helps instruct.</p><p></p><p>Here is some advice I would give the player:</p><p>* Make a few scrolls of the seldom used utilities spells. The scrolls don't cost that much XP, and allow them to have the spell available when really needed. Don't do this with the spells you always want, memorize those instead.</p><p>* You can leave spell slots open, and then fill them with a spell after 15 minutes preparation. Some people like this, others don't.</p><p>* Make a 'standard' spell list or two. Spells that would have almost always been useful. Each day, just modify off that standard spell list. Every mage I've ever played did this, usually only changing 2-3 spells a day.</p><p></p><p></p><p>As a GM, I have another suggestion. Rather than completely change the character, revise it slightly so she qualifies for the Mage of the Arcane Order PrC from Tome & Blood. This would allow her to spontaneously call for spells from the spellpool, and give you an opportunity to have other NPC mages advise her. You will probably have to change her feats to do this. Most mages don't take Cooperative Spell.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I think that the main differences between sorcerer and wizard are:</p><p></p><p>The wizard needs short term planning, while the sorcerer needs long term planning. If the wizard chooses to learn a worthless spell, they are only out some time and money. The sorcerer is stuck with that spell forever.</p><p></p><p>The sorcerer is more flexible in an in-promptu situation, while the wizard is more flexible in a planned encounter. The sorcerer keeps using the same spells for everything, while the wizard can pick the exact spell he or she needs for a specific situation.</p><p></p><p>The wizard is better at creating magical items.</p><p></p><p>The sorcerer will get more use out of metamagic feats, since he can add them at the time they cast them.</p><p></p><p>The wizard can make mistakes. If the wizard picks the wrong spell, they can come back the next day with the right spell. Once a spell is chosen by the Sorcerer, they have that spell for life.</p><p></p><p>The sorcerer is slightly better at weapons (can wear Spiked Guantlets), but much worse off for skills. The wizard will always have a high Int to give them bonus skill points, this is not true of the Sorcerer.</p><p></p><p>The Wizard can create scrolls, allowing him to spend money in order to have that specialized spell available when needed.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think that in the short term, the wizard is more frustrating. You are always thinking that 'if only I had prepared that spell'.</p><p></p><p>In the long term, the sorcerer is more frustrating. You are always thinking 'if only I had learned that spell, it would have gotten me out of this situation.'</p><p></p><p></p><p>Also try talking to the wife. If she would like it, allow the husband to 'run' a mentor NPC who talks to her about what she has done. Make suggestions of how she might better prepare for something in the future, and help her create 'standard' spell lists.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="bret, post: 486840, member: 713"] Part of the problem is by 6th level, the player has too many spells in their spellbook for a newbie to pick up. At a guess, the minimum values would be: 1st: 8 (6 to start, +2 as 2nd) 2nd 4 3rd 4 The wizard has probably picked up more from other sources. Probably only a couple of 3rd level, half-dozen at most of 2nd level, and maybe eight or so first level spells. Depends on the GM. I agree that making a special spellbook for the player would help a lot. So would having a familiar that helps instruct. Here is some advice I would give the player: * Make a few scrolls of the seldom used utilities spells. The scrolls don't cost that much XP, and allow them to have the spell available when really needed. Don't do this with the spells you always want, memorize those instead. * You can leave spell slots open, and then fill them with a spell after 15 minutes preparation. Some people like this, others don't. * Make a 'standard' spell list or two. Spells that would have almost always been useful. Each day, just modify off that standard spell list. Every mage I've ever played did this, usually only changing 2-3 spells a day. As a GM, I have another suggestion. Rather than completely change the character, revise it slightly so she qualifies for the Mage of the Arcane Order PrC from Tome & Blood. This would allow her to spontaneously call for spells from the spellpool, and give you an opportunity to have other NPC mages advise her. You will probably have to change her feats to do this. Most mages don't take Cooperative Spell. I think that the main differences between sorcerer and wizard are: The wizard needs short term planning, while the sorcerer needs long term planning. If the wizard chooses to learn a worthless spell, they are only out some time and money. The sorcerer is stuck with that spell forever. The sorcerer is more flexible in an in-promptu situation, while the wizard is more flexible in a planned encounter. The sorcerer keeps using the same spells for everything, while the wizard can pick the exact spell he or she needs for a specific situation. The wizard is better at creating magical items. The sorcerer will get more use out of metamagic feats, since he can add them at the time they cast them. The wizard can make mistakes. If the wizard picks the wrong spell, they can come back the next day with the right spell. Once a spell is chosen by the Sorcerer, they have that spell for life. The sorcerer is slightly better at weapons (can wear Spiked Guantlets), but much worse off for skills. The wizard will always have a high Int to give them bonus skill points, this is not true of the Sorcerer. The Wizard can create scrolls, allowing him to spend money in order to have that specialized spell available when needed. I think that in the short term, the wizard is more frustrating. You are always thinking that 'if only I had prepared that spell'. In the long term, the sorcerer is more frustrating. You are always thinking 'if only I had learned that spell, it would have gotten me out of this situation.' Also try talking to the wife. If she would like it, allow the husband to 'run' a mentor NPC who talks to her about what she has done. Make suggestions of how she might better prepare for something in the future, and help her create 'standard' spell lists. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Wizard vs. Sorcerer for Newbie
Top