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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dannyalcatraz" data-source="post: 4981736" data-attributes="member: 19675">I know you're not being snarky!Its not the DMs- of that I'm sure.  Our core group has, besides me, 4 other guys who have DMed adventures for the group, each with an individual playstyle.  At least one is a completely by-the-book type- no fudging either way.  Most- except me- favor a PHB only or PHB + Completes only type game, sans Psionics or anything like that, and minimal stuff (if anything) from extraneous campaign sourcebooks.  Usually, monster races are not allowed and alternative class features & templates are not used.  Sometimes, PHB classes or races get excluded, like Paladins and Halflings.  3PP stuff is right out.  Dragon magazine & the DCv1 aren't used very often, and you can usually forget PHB2, Unearthed Arcana and all that stuff.  (All- again- except me.)This doesn't mean, though, that PC builds are simple or cookie-cutter- especially in my case.  My Dex-based Monk with a polearm and my Mage-Brute both were run in that core group.Without the vast array of later-developed feats, spells and gear, the main factors in survivability have to be, IMHO: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A strong preference for PC builds- solo or multiclassed- including warrior classes.  Most builds are with base classes (regardless of role) only, as well.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Our generally stingy playstyle when it comes to spell use.</li> </ul>The preference for warrior classes in PC builds means we have better than average HP, AC and BAB on a per-PC basis.That we all tend to use spells like they're gold and not sand means that we generally have a little surprise left in store when most parties wouldn't.We use magic to get a situation under control, then let our melee prowess carry the battle.  Simply put, we get the upper hand, then slog it out, depending on our HP, AC and BAB to finish off our foes.  Now, our combats typically lasted much longer than the 3-4 rounds that so many people talk about, but when our casters stop casting, our foes are usually not landing a lot of high-damage blows anymore, and it starts looking like a back-alley beatdown.  With things under control, the casters stop casting...and sometimes even lend a hand with the odd crossbow bolt or thrown dagger.  Or coup-de-grace.IF something oddball happens, the magic came out again.  And because we're so stingy, even if a random encounter pops up or a rest-time raid occurs, we still have magic at our disposal.This actually goes back to the kind of stuff I was trying to get at in my ill-fated, poorly worded thread from last year, <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/d-d-3rd-edition-rules/240072-spr-quantification-theurge-style-prcls-3.html" target="_blank">SPR: Quantification of the "Theurge-style" PrCls</a>.As was correctly pointed out in that thread by many others, there are certain things only high-level magic can do.However, in my experience (over the 12 years in this group, playing 2Ed and 3.X, along with 11 more years prior experience with my Wiz-o-phile buddy), sometimes a lot of low-level magic- judiciously used- in accord with the right tactics and equipment can achieve the same goals, just not as quickly and efficiently.Our party got through RttToEE with few, if any, divine spells of level 3 or higher.  We didn't have the big massive heals, but we had slews of minor ones- the party was rarely at 100%, but we seldom got below 25%- and we had only one Wizard slinging big combat spells.</blockquote>

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