NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 4983564" data-attributes="member: 22779">See, there's the crux of the problem.  For some, it wasn't the fact that the wizard could "help the party get the job done" it was that "creative" use of spell casting got the job done full stop.  The wizard didn't need the party.Take invisiblity as a good example.  Sure, wizards in 1e and 2e got less slots, but, you only needed one invisibility spell.  It lasted 24 hours!  So long as you didn't attack, you were invisible for a whole day.  Or a whole day for the party with a 3rd level spell.  Who needs a scout?  You drop invisibility and you were pretty much good to go.  Worried about someone coming up on you while you're sleeping?  Invis is pretty much just as good as rope trick.Let's not forget that there were no rules for scent in 1e or 2e.  There was lip service given in the text, but, that was entirely up to the DM to interpret.  If the DM was generous, then you could wander an entire dungeon invisible, and you were golden.The "creative" use of spells is precisely the reason why 4e is written the way it is.  There is a segment of D&D gamers that doesn't like the fact that the way some spells are written allow "creative" use of spells.  In other words, they don't like the fact that caster players can play silly buggers word games with the DM and gain way more power that what is intended by the spell.  1st and 2nd level instant kill spells are a "creative" use of spells too.No one has a problem with wizards being able to polymorph.  That's a pretty standard trope.  What people do have a problem with is being able to polymorph into a Behir and instantly becoming a far better fighter than the fighter, hitting the Autowin button on any combat with a corporeal creature of size M or smaller.  And even the large creatures probably have a serious, serious problem.THAT's why wizards got beaten with the nerf bat.</blockquote>

Verification