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Message: <blockquote data-quote="5ekyu" data-source="post: 7768862" data-attributes="member: 6919838">Uhhh...No.The meta-gaming/bargaining/compelling/bribery nechanics used in many types of games where a trait is/can-be brought into play by a GM  offer of a gimmick point if the **player** accepts the proposed event/manifestation is not the only way you get flawed characters into play, not opposite "preferring perfect persons with no flaws" etc.For decades now many games have reoresented flaws (definitional ones) as things included by the player and that then occurred in play **without** any need for at the moment negotiation.In HERO and others, you could give your character very defining flaws that occurred in play, no bargain on the spot needed, just as part of the in-game play, no in-pkay meta-gaming by players.Phobia against spiders 14- debilitating - mecha-spiders attack - roll  fail and be frozen for a bit in panic - no bargain.In sime games, they brought with them extra points at part of chargen (as the bribe) but that avoided the in-game meta-game player bargaining by moving it up front.Other games presented these traits in a more naturally offsetting ways, no points or bribes, but with the idea that sonetimes they eould benefit you and other times not. A given virtue or flaw might give bonuses in one case and detriments in others - determined by situation - again - not meta-game player side on-the-spot negotiations.But then, in many games, folkdms just played characters with flaws as part of rolrme playing a character - no rules needed to provide any mechanics and benefits or pay-offs for "my guy hates orcs so i attack, no negotiating".In my experience, i saw more "flawed" and many ways more real peopke characters in play in game systems where there was little or no system defined flaw structures as the system did not get in the wsy of that part of the "who is this person?" definition and play by framing and trapping it in pre-formed structures of frequency, severity or "chip economy" - especially "chip-economy" that is significant in gameplay.One of the things that soured me over the2d20 system play was how so very greatly the fully integrated momentum gimmick points took over the mechanics of gameplay - momentum tally gains being the thing players cheered for in a lucky strike and seeming more important than what that strike did to the enemy in that fight. Whether one wants flawed chars or not is a wholly different thing from whether one wants those represented by meta-game player side bargains - esp ones with significant system play involved.</blockquote>

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