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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8133122" data-attributes="member: 6801228">I love how it has gone from "Nobles wouldn't have time to learn magic on top of all their other studies" to "I've never seen a setting where all the stupid people are highly educated" Before it was that they were too busy, now they aren't intelligent enough. Wonder if soon they will be too busy forming a band in their parent's garage, but then they would be bards and we'd go back to them not having enough time. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------And if you don't apply some logic then PCs just apparate out of then air fully formed, which is also nonsense. I'll take the nonsense that has some grounding in logic.So every person on the Enterprise who was in Engineering knew that they were fodder to be killed off in the episode? Because that is what being a red shirt meant, so they must have known that is was going to happen, right? Or, did they not have the context of that within the world of Star Trek? That is what I am saying, within the world of Star Trek they do not know that the Red Shirt is a sign of death and that the Captain will never be killed off. It is not a real fact in the world of the setting. The only time it gets brought up as a fact in the world is in comedy skits, because if it were true, then people in engineering would avoid leaving the ship and wear an emergency blue shirt under their uniform. Do you know the difference between watching a show and playing a game set in a world? Increased engagement. You engage more with the world and its logic as a player than you do as an observer. And, despite that, the "Red Shirt" problem is something that people point out about the show. People can choose to ignore it, but that doesn't mean that it isn't a crack in the way people interact with the world of Star Trek. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Again, who is the stronger fighter. The King or the King's Champion? It doesn't matter that they are "fresh our ot apprenticeship" because if they don't keep studying magic they won't progress in the class. they could be 3rd level and have finished their training two decades ago.Ah, I thought you were saying that fighters had to be strong and tough and fast. Not Strong or Tough or Fast. Must be even more paladins since they need to be strong or fast or tough or charismatic.Ah yes, I forget about those experts who specialize in letting you read other people's minds. Or those experts who can make you invisible.This is completely wrong, since if low level classes were terrible... that was part of the baseline.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------You realize people were hostile to magic in medieval europe because they thought it was the work of demons, right? People didn't fear magic before that, in fact Christian Spell Charms can be found dating back to the Roman Empire. Druids performed "magic" and they were leaders within their communities. And in DnD there are literal gods of magic. Boccob may not be a benevolent good guy, but he certainly isn't a devil seeking to drag souls to the Nine Hells, that's Asmodeus's stick. And, there is a good point to be made about legitimate authority. If the magic-users are the legitimate authority, they are going to dictate policy. Your assumption that magic only exists at the benevolence of the ruling class assumes that the ruling class existed in whole, and then the magic-users came in and started trying to do things. But, DnD clearly shows us that magic came before most of these existing structures. In fact, the history of fallen Magocracies in DnD worlds means that the idea that the people who are in charge are those who can use magic would be familiar to the common people, because that is how it was.</blockquote>

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