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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8133448" data-attributes="member: 6801228">And you aren't the only one I've been debating, and I've addressed your position repeatedly.See, things like this really make me question why I bother. Because my post had nothing at all to do with the Forgotten Realms. Boccob is the God of Magic in Greyhawk, and Asmodeus is in Greyhawk too. But, you thought I was talking about the Forgotten Realms. Oh, and Greyhawk had a magic empire in the recent past that had fallen to decay and ruin. Because the type of magic I'm talking about isn't specific to FR, it is in most settings. There is only one official setting I can think of that had a dearth of magic users and a near universal view that Arcane Magic was bad. Dark Sun. A game specifically removed from baseline DnD. Even if most DnD settings try and tell us that "magic is mysterious and not trusted" they will have three or four wizards within walking distance of every town, with a history of helping people around town. Then they will have a cleric or two, maybe a druid out there, and a bard that travels through town every month or so. So, nearly half a dozen familiar faces, with established roles in the community.-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Depends on the kingdom... only very rarely. In general the Champion is stronger. And that's fine. The King doesn't have to be the strongest warrior, even if he knows how to fight. So, why would the nobles in a society of mages have to be the strongest mages?Why? Every time magic has come up you've said they could just buy what they need, so why are you now saying they have to all be 5th level or higher? In fact, strength, as in combat strength, is literally the least important thing for a noble to have. They are the guys who lead armies, whether or not they can best people in single combat is relatively pointless unless they are dueling.Detect Thoughts is a second level spell. So is Invisibility. So... yes, you can read minds with a second level spell.Sounds like the baseline changed. Which is what I've been saying. Funny that.</blockquote>

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