Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Worlds of Design: From Zero to Hero
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="lewpuls" data-source="post: 9786756" data-attributes="member: 30518"><p style="text-align: center">[ATTACH=full]420606[/ATTACH]</p> <p style="text-align: center"><a href="https://pixabay.com/vectors/super-man-hero-success-employee-6698001/" target="_blank">Picture courtesy of Pixabay.</a></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The debate over the fundamental nature of the hero has endured for centuries. As noted by author <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G._K._Chesterton" target="_blank">G. K. Chesterton</a> (1874-1936), the appeal of the old fairy tale lies in making heroes start out as someone just like us. Conversely, Chesterton observed that the modern psychological novel often makes the hero abnormal. This distinction raises a perennial question for tabletop role-playing games: Are our heroes normal people or comic-book style superheroes?</p><p></p><p>This discussion continues a long-running inquiry into heroic identity, which we explored previously in discussions about whether heroes are <a href="https://www.enworld.org/threads/worlds-of-design-heroes-%E2%80%A6-made-or-born.687048/" target="_blank">born or made</a> and how <a href="https://www.enworld.org/threads/worlds-of-design-the-new-heroes.676822/" target="_blank">our perceptions of heroics have evolved</a> from a black and white morality to <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?4981-Heroes-In-Shades-Of-Grey" target="_blank">shades of grey</a>. Today, the focus is firmly on the question of normalcy.</p><h3>What's Normal, Anyway?</h3><p>To clarify the terms, we can define normal as "conforming to a typical or expected standard, being usual, ordinary, or average, and free from defect or irregularity." Abnormal, by contrast, simply means "deviating from what is normal or usual," without necessarily carrying a pejorative meaning. Even within the definition of "normal," there is a wide range; for instance, a person who is two meters tall is still within the realm of normal, though certainly an outlier.</p><h3>Fantasy and Mundane Archetypes</h3><p>Chesterton’s ideal of the "normal boy" is closely echoed by characters like Bilbo, Frodo, and Sam in <strong><em>The Hobbit </em></strong>and <strong><em>The Lord of the Rings</em></strong>. This is unsurprising, given that J.R.R. Tolkien was steeped in fairy tales and only a generation younger than Chesterton. It has been suggested that the hobbits, as a whole, represent normal people thrust into extraordinary circumstances.</p><p></p><p>Contrast this with Aragorn, who is born with a heroic destiny already assigned to him. Even so, he must apply bravery and dedication to achieve it, much like a gifted young athlete who must strive to become a star. Athletes themselves offer an interesting parallel to heroes, existing on both sides of the normal/abnormal spectrum. Players like <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Robinson" target="_blank">Brooks Robinson</a> became great through sheer hard work, while others start with exceptional gifts. Even an outlier like <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muggsy_Bogues" target="_blank">Mugsy Bogues</a>, a 5'3" NBA player in a sport dominated by larger athletes, can be seen as representing the normal among the abnormal.</p><h3>From Normal Start to Abnormal Finish</h3><p>How players and Game Masters approach character generation often dictates where a hero begins on this spectrum. Some GMs prefer to create "normal" characters by using dice-rolling methods like 3d6, forcing players to take abilities in the order rolled. Other GMs create "abnormal" characters right away by allowing players to generate far-above-average statistics or backgrounds. Even point-buy systems, like the one used in <strong><em>Dungeons & Dragons 5th Edition</em></strong>, might force characters to start as statistically normal, yet provide common pathways for them to become abnormal as they progress.</p><p></p><p>Regardless of their starting point, characters inevitably become abnormal at higher levels in many RPG systems, essentially becoming superheroes in a fantasy setting. This progression leads some GMs (myself included), to begin characters at higher tiers to ensure PCs are a little more extraordinary—and better able to survive—than a raw first-level character, even when using normal ability scores.</p><p></p><p>From the player's perspective, this decision hinges on the method of engagement: vicarious participation vs. acting. A player engaging vicariously might try to maintain a sense of "normal" behavior, doing what they would do in a given situation. Conversely, they may act "abnormally" due to the freedom afforded by the game. If the player views their role as an actor, the expectations of the rest of the table will strongly influence the character's level of normalcy.</p><p></p><p>In the end what's "normal" is really defined by the group. Most players play fantasy role-playing games to be heroes. And yet the basics of leveling systems like D&D imply that the character must start out weaker to make the journey all the more enjoyable, so that there is a clear difference in power between starting and ending a campaign. Levels provide the structure for superpowers, but adventuring makes those characters superheroes.</p><p></p><p><strong>Your Turn: Are the heroes in your RPG games predominantly normal, abnormal, or somewhere in between?</strong></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="lewpuls, post: 9786756, member: 30518"] [CENTER][ATTACH type="full" alt="super-6698001_1280.jpg"]420606[/ATTACH] [URL='https://pixabay.com/vectors/super-man-hero-success-employee-6698001/']Picture courtesy of Pixabay.[/URL][/CENTER] The debate over the fundamental nature of the hero has endured for centuries. As noted by author [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G._K._Chesterton']G. K. Chesterton[/URL] (1874-1936), the appeal of the old fairy tale lies in making heroes start out as someone just like us. Conversely, Chesterton observed that the modern psychological novel often makes the hero abnormal. This distinction raises a perennial question for tabletop role-playing games: Are our heroes normal people or comic-book style superheroes? This discussion continues a long-running inquiry into heroic identity, which we explored previously in discussions about whether heroes are [URL='https://www.enworld.org/threads/worlds-of-design-heroes-%E2%80%A6-made-or-born.687048/']born or made[/URL] and how [URL='https://www.enworld.org/threads/worlds-of-design-the-new-heroes.676822/']our perceptions of heroics have evolved[/URL] from a black and white morality to [URL='http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?4981-Heroes-In-Shades-Of-Grey']shades of grey[/URL]. Today, the focus is firmly on the question of normalcy. [HEADING=2]What's Normal, Anyway?[/HEADING] To clarify the terms, we can define normal as "conforming to a typical or expected standard, being usual, ordinary, or average, and free from defect or irregularity." Abnormal, by contrast, simply means "deviating from what is normal or usual," without necessarily carrying a pejorative meaning. Even within the definition of "normal," there is a wide range; for instance, a person who is two meters tall is still within the realm of normal, though certainly an outlier. [HEADING=2]Fantasy and Mundane Archetypes[/HEADING] Chesterton’s ideal of the "normal boy" is closely echoed by characters like Bilbo, Frodo, and Sam in [B][I]The Hobbit [/I][/B]and [B][I]The Lord of the Rings[/I][/B]. This is unsurprising, given that J.R.R. Tolkien was steeped in fairy tales and only a generation younger than Chesterton. It has been suggested that the hobbits, as a whole, represent normal people thrust into extraordinary circumstances. Contrast this with Aragorn, who is born with a heroic destiny already assigned to him. Even so, he must apply bravery and dedication to achieve it, much like a gifted young athlete who must strive to become a star. Athletes themselves offer an interesting parallel to heroes, existing on both sides of the normal/abnormal spectrum. Players like [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Robinson']Brooks Robinson[/URL] became great through sheer hard work, while others start with exceptional gifts. Even an outlier like [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muggsy_Bogues']Mugsy Bogues[/URL], a 5'3" NBA player in a sport dominated by larger athletes, can be seen as representing the normal among the abnormal. [HEADING=2]From Normal Start to Abnormal Finish[/HEADING] How players and Game Masters approach character generation often dictates where a hero begins on this spectrum. Some GMs prefer to create "normal" characters by using dice-rolling methods like 3d6, forcing players to take abilities in the order rolled. Other GMs create "abnormal" characters right away by allowing players to generate far-above-average statistics or backgrounds. Even point-buy systems, like the one used in [B][I]Dungeons & Dragons 5th Edition[/I][/B], might force characters to start as statistically normal, yet provide common pathways for them to become abnormal as they progress. Regardless of their starting point, characters inevitably become abnormal at higher levels in many RPG systems, essentially becoming superheroes in a fantasy setting. This progression leads some GMs (myself included), to begin characters at higher tiers to ensure PCs are a little more extraordinary—and better able to survive—than a raw first-level character, even when using normal ability scores. From the player's perspective, this decision hinges on the method of engagement: vicarious participation vs. acting. A player engaging vicariously might try to maintain a sense of "normal" behavior, doing what they would do in a given situation. Conversely, they may act "abnormally" due to the freedom afforded by the game. If the player views their role as an actor, the expectations of the rest of the table will strongly influence the character's level of normalcy. In the end what's "normal" is really defined by the group. Most players play fantasy role-playing games to be heroes. And yet the basics of leveling systems like D&D imply that the character must start out weaker to make the journey all the more enjoyable, so that there is a clear difference in power between starting and ending a campaign. Levels provide the structure for superpowers, but adventuring makes those characters superheroes. [B]Your Turn: Are the heroes in your RPG games predominantly normal, abnormal, or somewhere in between?[/B] [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Worlds of Design: From Zero to Hero
Top