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Worlds of Design: In the Shadow of Tolkien
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<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 9715628" data-attributes="member: 6790260"><p>While I think it is possible to read it this way, I would personally disagree.</p><p></p><p>Sauron is <em>incredibly</em> confident when he thinks Aragorn is riding out to meet him bearing the Ring. He genuinely can't conceive of a leader who would refuse to use its power. <em>That's</em> what makes Aragorn what he is; someone who trusts Providence enough to forgo such things. Like Gandalf and Galadriel, he refuses the temptation, though for him it is clearly easier (and that ease is one part that contributes to him being a Christianized hero.) Frodo isn't really any kind of hero at all, at least not in my view. He's genuinely an ordinary (if well-to-do) person ground down by the wheel, and rescued by the actions of others--someone, in a sense, always controlled by others, never truly in control of his own destiny. Absolute power and the temptation of evil broke him, and he never truly recovers, but he does still find forgiveness and succor.</p><p></p><p>But, again, I think this is a reasonable reading that can point to some parts of the text to back it up. I just think that the greater weight is on Frodo as "not actually a hero <em>at all</em>, and thus broken by a world that demands he be something he isn't." Which isn't exactly a surprising sentiment coming from a man who fought in WWI and took courses to train for the cipher bureau in WWII (and who had sons that served in WWII).</p><p></p><p></p><p>Fully agreed. The problem with the Ring is that, even with a maia-vs-maia battle, direct confrontation would be too dangerous. All of them knew they would need to weaken the enemy by developing their own power base first, and that very thing is what would doom them. As Gandalf said, "Do not tempt me! For I do not wish to become like the Dark Lord himself. Yet the way of the Ring to my heart is by pity, pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good. Do not tempt me! I dare not take it, not even to keep it safe, unused. The wish to wield it would be too great for my strength. I shall have such need of it. Great perils lie before me.” </p><p></p><p>Even Aragorn would have succumbed with time, even with all his advantages--and Sauron was probably <em>right</em> to assume that a mere man, Numenorean or not, could not stand toe to toe with him, a maia, fallen or otherwise. The Ring would all too likely betray him as it had Isildur. Aragorn's strength lies in his refusal to use it. That's what makes him among the purest good characters. He cognitively understands what the Ring could do for him, but he never once betrays an interest in it--even if he felt it deep in his heart, he's strong enough to squelch it into utter silence.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yeah, I don't think it's an allegory per se, or if it is, it's a pretty mild one. Instead, it's more speculative fiction. <em>If</em> this power existed, what would it do? And the answer is: corrupt anyone ambitious enough to claim it. This isn't a story that has a Cincinnatus archetype, the person who can take up absolute power for just one month and then cast it aside the instant it isn't needed anymore.</p><p></p><p>Completely agreed on Tom, yeah. As Gandalf notes, he's more than strong enough to protect the Ring...but he is almost totally inhuman in his utter lack of interest. The Ring can't touch him, but in a certain sense, he can't touch the Ring either. It's a non-entity to him, which makes him incapable of being its guardian. I don't think he's foolish enough to fail to understand why others care, but he just...doesn't.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 9715628, member: 6790260"] While I think it is possible to read it this way, I would personally disagree. Sauron is [I]incredibly[/I] confident when he thinks Aragorn is riding out to meet him bearing the Ring. He genuinely can't conceive of a leader who would refuse to use its power. [I]That's[/I] what makes Aragorn what he is; someone who trusts Providence enough to forgo such things. Like Gandalf and Galadriel, he refuses the temptation, though for him it is clearly easier (and that ease is one part that contributes to him being a Christianized hero.) Frodo isn't really any kind of hero at all, at least not in my view. He's genuinely an ordinary (if well-to-do) person ground down by the wheel, and rescued by the actions of others--someone, in a sense, always controlled by others, never truly in control of his own destiny. Absolute power and the temptation of evil broke him, and he never truly recovers, but he does still find forgiveness and succor. But, again, I think this is a reasonable reading that can point to some parts of the text to back it up. I just think that the greater weight is on Frodo as "not actually a hero [I]at all[/I], and thus broken by a world that demands he be something he isn't." Which isn't exactly a surprising sentiment coming from a man who fought in WWI and took courses to train for the cipher bureau in WWII (and who had sons that served in WWII). Fully agreed. The problem with the Ring is that, even with a maia-vs-maia battle, direct confrontation would be too dangerous. All of them knew they would need to weaken the enemy by developing their own power base first, and that very thing is what would doom them. As Gandalf said, "Do not tempt me! For I do not wish to become like the Dark Lord himself. Yet the way of the Ring to my heart is by pity, pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good. Do not tempt me! I dare not take it, not even to keep it safe, unused. The wish to wield it would be too great for my strength. I shall have such need of it. Great perils lie before me.” Even Aragorn would have succumbed with time, even with all his advantages--and Sauron was probably [I]right[/I] to assume that a mere man, Numenorean or not, could not stand toe to toe with him, a maia, fallen or otherwise. The Ring would all too likely betray him as it had Isildur. Aragorn's strength lies in his refusal to use it. That's what makes him among the purest good characters. He cognitively understands what the Ring could do for him, but he never once betrays an interest in it--even if he felt it deep in his heart, he's strong enough to squelch it into utter silence. Yeah, I don't think it's an allegory per se, or if it is, it's a pretty mild one. Instead, it's more speculative fiction. [I]If[/I] this power existed, what would it do? And the answer is: corrupt anyone ambitious enough to claim it. This isn't a story that has a Cincinnatus archetype, the person who can take up absolute power for just one month and then cast it aside the instant it isn't needed anymore. Completely agreed on Tom, yeah. As Gandalf notes, he's more than strong enough to protect the Ring...but he is almost totally inhuman in his utter lack of interest. The Ring can't touch him, but in a certain sense, he can't touch the Ring either. It's a non-entity to him, which makes him incapable of being its guardian. I don't think he's foolish enough to fail to understand why others care, but he just...doesn't. [/QUOTE]
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