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Worlds of Design: RPG Gods - Benign or Malign?
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<blockquote data-quote="Helldritch" data-source="post: 8729843" data-attributes="member: 6855114"><p>Ok, gods in fantasy...</p><p></p><p>My approach is both varied and quite static. Gods in a fantasy setting can not be compared to real world religions. Simply because if a worshiper has any doubt, he can ask his God and chances are that the god in question will answer. </p><p>So having schism in a religion in a fantasy setting is kind of not knowing the simple fact that with priest and clerics able to speak directly with their god, this can not happen. </p><p></p><p>And if you try to tell me that non caster can be in the church hierarchy this is again something entirely BS to say. The lowest caster will prime on the highest non caster follower of the deity simply because that deity is favoring the caster. The cleric/priest casts spells because the god grants them directly to him/her. That is quite an endorsement that can not be compared to a non caster. </p><p></p><p>So with gods active and willing to intervene according to some rules where does that lead us to? Why do gods needs worshippers? Simple, power. The power of gods are directly related to the number of worshippers they have. This was so in AD&D and it explained why there were pantheon wars. The Greek Pantheon attacking Norse pantheon to acquire new worshippers and so on. But at the same time, war in heavens and hells are to be avoided as gods fighting each others could level the cosmos. So they act through their worshippers to avoid destroying the source of their power, devotion (or fear) of their worshippers. </p><p></p><p>Because worshippers have souls or spirits they can give energy to the gods that can harness it. Mortal worship the neutral and good gods with devotions and prayers and evil one are placate with fear and offering to appease them. Whatever the method, the god gets what he needs, worship energy. As the god gets more and more worshippers (or gets appeased) he gets more power and rises in power. This is why in old editions we had greater, lesser and demi gods. (Yes, I know about major and quasi deities). </p><p></p><p>It is also why demons and devils want to divert mortals from the gods. To deprive them of their powers. Even if demons and devils gain nothing from their devotion, they deprive their foes from the source of their power and that is in and if itself a victory. And with every souls perverted away from the gods, the fiends can use the souls as nourishment or as a power to create more of their kind to fight the gods (or other fiends). </p><p></p><p>On the warlocks....</p><p>Some people like to point that warlocks gain spells in a similar way as the clerics and other divine casters. In this case similar is not the same thing as the same. Fiends (and other patrons) can fragment a part of their essence and put it into the warlock. Most warlock can not even heal because that is not the nature of the normal patrons. Recently, some angels have taken on them to become patrons too. Thus the appearance of the new warlock subclass. But again, this is not the same as the god giving powers to his clerics. It might looks like it but it isn't. Normally, a fiend or a non god, should have a limited number of warlock under contract as the non god must fragment its essence (well a part) to give power to the warlock. As long as the warlock is obedient and works to further the goals of his/her patron everything should work out fine. Far realm patrons wants to come back, fey patron might be fickle but want to protect the few entries to the feywild, fiends are obvious and the rest should be also easy to figure out. </p><p></p><p>So gods wants worshippers to get powers. This is as simple as that. If you have multiple pantheons, they fight among each others for the precious resource that are worshippers and it explains why evil deities are not banned from a pantheon. They are needed to cover the domain in the pantheon. </p><p></p><p>If however, your world have only one pantheon, then evil deities work for themselves only and the justification for them is a bit harder to make but still possible. It is just that the war is between the gods and that they are vying for power just the same. Fiends still want to deprive the gods from their power source. But it might make for a more active role of the gods in the world and against fiends. Since they do not have to contend with other pantheons they could be more active against fiends and much more prone to ally with each other when faced with fiends incursion while in multiple pantheons, evil deity in the pantheon might simply not risk themselves hoping to see a comrade fall and to take its power...</p><p></p><p>All in all, gods can be anything you need them to be. Just do not over do it or over use them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Helldritch, post: 8729843, member: 6855114"] Ok, gods in fantasy... My approach is both varied and quite static. Gods in a fantasy setting can not be compared to real world religions. Simply because if a worshiper has any doubt, he can ask his God and chances are that the god in question will answer. So having schism in a religion in a fantasy setting is kind of not knowing the simple fact that with priest and clerics able to speak directly with their god, this can not happen. And if you try to tell me that non caster can be in the church hierarchy this is again something entirely BS to say. The lowest caster will prime on the highest non caster follower of the deity simply because that deity is favoring the caster. The cleric/priest casts spells because the god grants them directly to him/her. That is quite an endorsement that can not be compared to a non caster. So with gods active and willing to intervene according to some rules where does that lead us to? Why do gods needs worshippers? Simple, power. The power of gods are directly related to the number of worshippers they have. This was so in AD&D and it explained why there were pantheon wars. The Greek Pantheon attacking Norse pantheon to acquire new worshippers and so on. But at the same time, war in heavens and hells are to be avoided as gods fighting each others could level the cosmos. So they act through their worshippers to avoid destroying the source of their power, devotion (or fear) of their worshippers. Because worshippers have souls or spirits they can give energy to the gods that can harness it. Mortal worship the neutral and good gods with devotions and prayers and evil one are placate with fear and offering to appease them. Whatever the method, the god gets what he needs, worship energy. As the god gets more and more worshippers (or gets appeased) he gets more power and rises in power. This is why in old editions we had greater, lesser and demi gods. (Yes, I know about major and quasi deities). It is also why demons and devils want to divert mortals from the gods. To deprive them of their powers. Even if demons and devils gain nothing from their devotion, they deprive their foes from the source of their power and that is in and if itself a victory. And with every souls perverted away from the gods, the fiends can use the souls as nourishment or as a power to create more of their kind to fight the gods (or other fiends). On the warlocks.... Some people like to point that warlocks gain spells in a similar way as the clerics and other divine casters. In this case similar is not the same thing as the same. Fiends (and other patrons) can fragment a part of their essence and put it into the warlock. Most warlock can not even heal because that is not the nature of the normal patrons. Recently, some angels have taken on them to become patrons too. Thus the appearance of the new warlock subclass. But again, this is not the same as the god giving powers to his clerics. It might looks like it but it isn't. Normally, a fiend or a non god, should have a limited number of warlock under contract as the non god must fragment its essence (well a part) to give power to the warlock. As long as the warlock is obedient and works to further the goals of his/her patron everything should work out fine. Far realm patrons wants to come back, fey patron might be fickle but want to protect the few entries to the feywild, fiends are obvious and the rest should be also easy to figure out. So gods wants worshippers to get powers. This is as simple as that. If you have multiple pantheons, they fight among each others for the precious resource that are worshippers and it explains why evil deities are not banned from a pantheon. They are needed to cover the domain in the pantheon. If however, your world have only one pantheon, then evil deities work for themselves only and the justification for them is a bit harder to make but still possible. It is just that the war is between the gods and that they are vying for power just the same. Fiends still want to deprive the gods from their power source. But it might make for a more active role of the gods in the world and against fiends. Since they do not have to contend with other pantheons they could be more active against fiends and much more prone to ally with each other when faced with fiends incursion while in multiple pantheons, evil deity in the pantheon might simply not risk themselves hoping to see a comrade fall and to take its power... All in all, gods can be anything you need them to be. Just do not over do it or over use them. [/QUOTE]
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