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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 8183096" data-attributes="member: 22779">Beginner sets are not full RPG's though, are they?&nbsp; They are, well, beginner sets.&nbsp; Stripped down rulesets with many of the options turned off.&nbsp; No one plays the Star Trek Adventures Beginner Box more than once, do they?&nbsp; You play the Beginner boxes with the notion of learning how to play the actual game.&nbsp; They aren't meant as a full RPG on their own.&nbsp; Even going back to Basic D&amp;D, it wasn't meant to be a stand alone product.&nbsp; You mention Squad Leader.&nbsp; Thing is, every time I play Squad Leader, it's going to be very similar to every other time I play Squad Leader.&nbsp; Sure, the specific scenario might be different, but, it's still going to be an armed conflict within a very limited time period.&nbsp; I can't use Squad Leader to play out Star Fleet Battles after all.&nbsp; See, even the &quot;Here's how to build a scenario&quot; rules for wargames are still constrained by the limitations of those wargames.&nbsp; The scenarios are extremely proscribed by the mechanics of that system.&nbsp; You will never play a game of Necromunda where you are courtiers in a royal court in one campaign and dirt poor street urchins in the next campaign, and then murder hoboes in the third campaign, all with the same ruleset.&nbsp; I can do all three of those with any number of RPG rulesets.&nbsp; I cannot do all three of those with virtually any boxed game or computer game.&nbsp; I could use the Traveller rules to do Battlestar Galactica (Original or Reboot), Buck Rogers, Pitch Black or Farscape.&nbsp; No single non RPG will allow me to do that.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 8183096, member: 22779"] Beginner sets are not full RPG's though, are they? They are, well, beginner sets. Stripped down rulesets with many of the options turned off. No one plays the Star Trek Adventures Beginner Box more than once, do they? You play the Beginner boxes with the notion of learning how to play the actual game. They aren't meant as a full RPG on their own. Even going back to Basic D&D, it wasn't meant to be a stand alone product. You mention Squad Leader. Thing is, every time I play Squad Leader, it's going to be very similar to every other time I play Squad Leader. Sure, the specific scenario might be different, but, it's still going to be an armed conflict within a very limited time period. I can't use Squad Leader to play out Star Fleet Battles after all. See, even the "Here's how to build a scenario" rules for wargames are still constrained by the limitations of those wargames. The scenarios are extremely proscribed by the mechanics of that system. You will never play a game of Necromunda where you are courtiers in a royal court in one campaign and dirt poor street urchins in the next campaign, and then murder hoboes in the third campaign, all with the same ruleset. I can do all three of those with any number of RPG rulesets. I cannot do all three of those with virtually any boxed game or computer game. I could use the Traveller rules to do Battlestar Galactica (Original or Reboot), Buck Rogers, Pitch Black or Farscape. No single non RPG will allow me to do that. [/QUOTE]

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