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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Rob Kuntz" data-source="post: 8244677" data-attributes="member: 7015759">Yes, it's a recurring subject with extreme POVs.  Part of it, not all, has to do with the real empowerment of PCs via the rules that allow them to conquer all and survive everything; and this appears to be P&P's adaptation of what CRPGs extol.  In game history contexts this extreme POV (player agency only) defies hundreds of years of fore-matter based on the zero-sum model and the idea of informed and fair play.  The VAST majority of games of all spectrums have the idea of win or lose built into them of course. Therein lies the challenge to improve even if the luck factor (dice rolls) equal such matters out in less definite ways. How many games of Monopoly have I lost?  Many more than I've won.Then there is the fictive-form of RPG characters.  Stories that inspired this form were scripted affairs, all of them.  However, the RPG character is not a scripted participant (unless one considers the A-B-C mode of scripted outcomes via adventures that these characters often participate in).  In any case they are building their histories to full fledge heroes or noted characters of presence.  But if we assume that they are already heroic and that their paths will always be such without the same proofs as, let's say, in Conan having to progress from slave to King, finally, then perhaps we are not so much in the realm of Fantasy any longer but have strayed into fantasizing?  It is a subject of great interest for me and that I've studied from several converging viewpoints.</blockquote>

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