WOTC Business Strategy and miniatures

[pogre]

If I recall correctly when WOTC was going to launch 3E they wanted an aspect of the game to lead to repeat purchases. Something that would have players come in and drop five or six bucks every time they hit the hobby store. Not exactly, the MTG model - but still have the players continually buying things. WOTC considered the miniatures an integral part of their business strategy.

Now, I'm speaking from my own hazy memory - so if I misstep, please correct me.

For a variety of reasons the strategy did not work out quite as well as they hoped (that's an impression I have).

Now Wotc is going to launch 3.5, and the rules look like they really want you to use miniatures. They are also launching their pre-painted plastic figures this Fall. This looks like the same strategy, just refined a bit from their experience in the market.

I love miniatures. The new greater use of miniatures in D&D is one reason I came back to it.

But, you folks who criticize 3.5 as being too miniatures-dependent: Doesn't this look like a sound business strategy for WOTC?
*Sell core rulebooks to everyone
*Sell miniatures to everyone (except pogre who loves to paint)
*Let the 3rd parties sell most of the DM targeted stuff.

If one can concede this looks like a money-making plan, why does it make folks mad? If you do not buy the assumption that it is a money-making plan - what's the flaw?

I think there is a market for a pdf or small book on running 3.5 without miniatures from the reaction against WOTC I have seen on the boards as of late.

 

[rushlight]

Apparently many people who post on message boards have some inherent need to whine and complain about /everything/. Just look around here for people going on and on about a book they don't even have to buy. Or you can go to Games Workshop's WH 40k forums (http://www.games-workshop.com/community/40kforum.htm) and listen to people whine about *trial* rules changes. That they don't even need to use. Or perhaps go to Fox Network's webpage for their new show Banzai! (http://www.fox.com/banzai) and listen to people up in arms about a show they don't have to watch.

Or just go to any board about any game or TV show and you'll find an endless stream of people who are complaining about the way things are/were/should be. The question is: are whiners more apt to post on boards, or are boards turning people into whiners? Perhaps that's best left to the philosophers...

By the way, that show Banzai! was *hilarious*. I nearly wet myself. I can't wait to play online during next week's episode!

 

[pogre]

Thanks for the response rushlight.

People who do not play with miniatures have a right to be upset about miniatures now being an essential part of the game.

My question is not why are you upset, but what is upsetting about it? Is it because:

(1) WOTC is missing the boat and could do it better by doing XXX (be specific) or

(2) This is the way of things in big market gaming (which I admit to me is pretty close to whining).

If there is not a better strategy for making money - shouldn't D&D rely on miniatures in combat?

 

[apocalypstick]

I think it originally had something to do with WotC holding the rights to creatures such as Umber Hulks and Driders (Spider-Centaurs, hee-hee) and various other whatevers, and refusing to let anybody make minis of them after the Partha deal expired.

Then came Chainmail, which a lot (??) of people bought into and was discontinued.

Enter the new WotC mini scheme, which offers randomized packs of plastic sculpts which don't look all that impressive.

...

me, personally, I don't care... I'm a Reaper man, through and through, and what WotC does or doesn't do is, well... I guess I can see why people would complain about it, but when you've got Reaper, why bother?

(Spider-Centaur... hee-hee)

 

[Celtavian]

re

I don't think I am the average consumer, but I probably wouldn't pay for a book on how to run D&D without miniatures. If WotC has made it impossible to run without miniatures or extremely difficult, then I will use the 3.0 movement system which has worked well for us to date.

We do always use maps drawn on graph paper. We do religiously plot movement. I hope movement is still listed in feet as well as squares, or I and probably several other folks will be extremely pissed off.

 

[pogre]

me, personally, I don't care... I'm a Reaper man, through and through, and what WotC does or doesn't do is, well... I guess I can see why people would complain about it, but when you've got Reaper, why bother?
(Spider-Centaur... hee-hee)

I'm a Reaper man myself. Just finished painting their Vulture Demon (Vrock) - awesome figure. shhh don't tell my group.

I just was hoping to hear from the non-miniatures crowd.

 

[pogre]

Re: re

I hope movement is still listed in feet as well as squares, or I and probably several other folks will be extremely pissed off.

The Squares thing does not bother me too much, but I think it's pretty goofy. We use a tape measure for our game. Back to 1E for that I suppose.

I suspect that you are right on when it comes to how a lot of people are going to run the game withour figs.

 

[rushlight]

Re: re

I don't think I am the average consumer, but I probably wouldn't pay for a book on how to run D&D without miniatures. If WotC has made it impossible to run without miniatures or extremely difficult, then I will use the 3.0 movement system which has worked well for us to date.

We do always use maps drawn on graph paper. We do religiously plot movement. I hope movement is still listed in feet as well as squares, or I and probably several other folks will be extremely pissed off.

Well, after having to convert feet to squares for so long, it's time for the other side to do some math.

Just to assist you, 1 Square = 5 Feet.

I trust you'll use this information cautiously, and not get too careless passing it around. It's actually quite the secret.

 

[Fenes 2]

I don't use miniatures. If I did use miniatures, I would not use a battlemap so that my movement options were not limited to squares. I doubt I will be forced to use minis anytime soon. Some people apparently have problems using AoOs without minis, but I never had any trouble with that - a little sketch serves fine if needed, and most of the time the players already know if some character is threatened since they had or were hit before, so most actions that draw AoOs are a no-brainer to handle. Movement is a bit trickier, but a player just says if he wants to circle around an enemy while staying out of his reach, or uses tumble (or just says "darn the AoO, I charge!").

Now, I recently bought some counters from Fiery Dragon, and I think I'll go for customized counters. I can draw a bit better than modify a miniature, it is less work, since I already make sketches of PCs and NPCs, and I can get a counter exactly like I envision a character, down to clothing. Still won't use hexes or squares though - too limiting imho.

 

[DaveMage]

The problem I have with miniatures in general is that you can never have *all* the monsters.

As a DM, I like to try out new monsters on my players each time we play. If I pick up a new monster book (such as the Penumbra Fantasy Bestiary), there will be no miniatures available for those creatures. (Or even if there were, can you imagine how expensive it would be?!?)

So, instead, we use dice or a different miniature or counter to represent that creature.

The bottom line is, miniature collecting and playing D&D are really separate things that can cross over, but if you collect and use miniatures, it's more a luxury of the game (or an art form of its own) rather than a necessity.

If I was new to the D&D hobby (or wanted to introduce it to someone else), and I read that I needed to purchase miniatures ON TOP OF the $90 I needed to spend on core rulebooks, I think I'd look for a different hobby. Especially if I interpreted the rules to mean that I had to have a miniature for each creature in the MM, which I could see someone doing.

I think the language WotC used in the PH introduction about miniatures under "what you need to play" was very poor, since it's really not true.