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Message: <blockquote data-quote="firesnakearies" data-source="post: 5186836" data-attributes="member: 71334">Well, ultimately it was easy because our DM respected my defender mark WAY too much and chose to have the monsters focus way too much attention on my character, rather than ignoring me and going persistently after the striker.  Because I set out to build a Warden who would be "unkillable" even without a healer, and boy, did I succeed.  So the DM should have had a lot more creatures just ignore me and go after the much squishier and insane-damage-dealing Sorcerer (or Monk in a few sessions), and that would have changed the whole story.However, because there were only two of us, and no real healer, he kinda felt like he couldn't do that, or else he'd too easily kill off the striker, and then it would just be me, and how lame would that be?I dunno, our DM isn't super-tactical, and is too worried about being nice, and not being "unfair".  And the other two guys whom I played with off and on, and myself, ARE super-tactical, and really damn good players.  So we kinda ran wild over the encounters.Here's what my Warden (multiclassed Warlord and Druid) looked like going into the last session of the adventure:[sblock]====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======Adamas the Uncarved, level 23Dwarf, Warden, Earthfast Brigadier, ChosenBuild: Earth WardenGuardian Might: EarthstrengthDivine Spark: Divine Spark ConstitutionDivine Spark: Divine Spark StrengthBackground: Windrise Ports, Earth Steward, Revered Elder, Thunderpeaks (Windrise Ports Benefit)FINAL ABILITY SCORESStr 22, Con 28, Dex 12, Int 12, Wis 15, Cha 10.STARTING ABILITY SCORESStr 14, Con 18, Dex 10, Int 10, Wis 11, Cha 8.AC: 43 Fort: 36 Reflex: 29 Will: 29HP: 214 Surges: 23 Surge Value: 62TRAINED SKILLSNature +18, Dungeoneering +22, Perception +18, Athletics +20, Endurance +27UNTRAINED SKILLSAcrobatics +10, Arcana +12, Bluff +11, Diplomacy +11, Heal +13, History +12, Insight +13, Intimidate +11, Religion +12, Stealth +10, Streetwise +11, Thievery +10FEATSLevel 1: ToughnessLevel 2: Student of BattleLevel 4: Initiate of the Old FaithLevel 6: DurableLevel 8: Timely RespiteLevel 10: Earthstrength ResilienceLevel 11: Dwarven DurabilityLevel 12: Vital FormLevel 14: Earthstrength DefensesLevel 16: Hammer RhythmLevel 18: Weapon Expertise (Hammer)Level 20: Improved Initiative (retrained to Stoneheart Warrior at Level 21)Level 21: Epic RecoveryLevel 22: Second SkinPOWERSInitiate of the Old Faith: Swarming LocustsWarden at-will 1: Strength of StoneWarden at-will 1: Tempest AssaultWarden encounter 1: Roots of StoneWarden daily 1: Form of Mountain's ThunderWarden utility 2: Erupting FontWarden encounter 3: Earthgrasp StrikeWarden daily 5: Wellspring StrikeWarden utility 6: Bear's EnduranceWarden encounter 7: Mountain HammerWarden daily 9: Form of the Stone SentinelWarden utility 10: Spiritual RejuvenationWarden encounter 13: Ponderous Strike (replaces Roots of Stone)Warden daily 15: Form of the Crushing Mountain (replaces Wellspring Strike)Warden utility 16: Vine PoulticeWarden encounter 17: Earth Hold's Rebuke (replaces Ponderous Strike)Warden daily 19: Form of the Crushing Mountain (replaces Form of the Crushing Mountain)Warden utility 22: Wellspring of LifeITEMSStalkerhide Armor of Enduring Health +5, Pierced Heart Tattoo (paragon tier), Rousing Hammer Throwing hammer +1, Hammer Shield Heavy Shield (heroic tier), Iron Ring of the Dwarf Lords (paragon tier), Dynamic Warhammer +5, Necklace of Fate +4, Backbone Belt (paragon tier), Parry Gauntlets (heroic tier), Boots of Quickness (heroic tier), Circlet of Indomitability (heroic tier), Phylactery of Action (heroic tier), Bracers of Brachiation (heroic tier), Wavestrider Boots (heroic tier), Cap of Water Breathing (heroic tier), Reading Spectacles (heroic tier), Cannith Goggles (heroic tier), Moradin's Blessing of Iron (level 3), Potion of Clarity (level 10) (5), Salve of Power (heroic tier) (4), Backpack (empty), Bedroll (2), Climber's Kit, Crowbar, Everburning Torch (2), Flask (empty) (2), Flint and Steel, Holy Symbol, Oil (1 pint) (2), Hempen Rope (50 ft.) (2), Pitons (10), Belt Pouch (empty) (2), Torch (2), Waterskin (2), Trail Rations (30), Sunrod (20), Potion of Healing (heroic tier), Maw of the Guardian Warhammer +5, Handy Haversack (heroic tier), Everlasting Provisions (heroic tier), Solitaire (Violet) (epic tier), Residuum (Any) (50000), Bloodcrystal Raven Skull (epic tier), The Raven Queen's Shroud (level 23), Dawn Warrior Warhammer +5, Ring of the Fallen (paragon tier), Potion of Vitality (paragon tier) (10), Potion of Resistance (paragon tier) (5), Glowstone (heroic tier) (5), Tempest Whetstone (heroic tier) (30), Unguent of Darkvision (paragon tier) (4), Foe Stone (paragon tier), Sending Stones (pair) (paragon tier), Map of Orienteering (heroic tier), Endless Canteen (heroic tier), Watchful Eye (paragon tier), Sail of Winds (paragon tier)RITUALSScroll of Raise Dead======[/sblock]All of that stuff he's got is just the standard starting kit for a level 21 character, plus what we found in the actual adventure.  And note that there are several of those powers that I literally never used in the entire adventure, because I didn't need to, or only used once ever.  (Wellspring of Life, Form of the Stone Sentinel, and Bear's Endurance were all big self-healing daily powers that I never used even a single time in the whole adventure.  I never needed to use Spiritual Rejuvenation in the whole adventure, either.  Vine Poultice is another daily heal that I only ever used once, on the other player.  The daily Inspiring Word I used three or four times, but always only on the other guy.)The key to Adamas' invincibility is the ludicrousness of epic Dwarf Warden Second Wind nonsense.  First of all, note the 214 hit points and 23 healing surges per day.  Then consider that he can use Second Wind at least four times every single encounter, as a free action.  (And had daily powers to give himself an additional use twice more, so he could, if necessary, use Second Wind six times in a single encounter, once a day.  That was never necessary for me.)When he uses Second Wind (as a free action, mind you) some serious ridiculousness occurs:He gets back 91 hit points, can make an immediate saving throw, gains resist 8 all until the end of his next turn, gains +4 damage to his next attack, and gains +15 to all four defenses until the beginning/end of his next turn.  As a free action.  At least four times every encounter.And then I had all of those other powers to use for self-heals, regeneration, auto-getting back up at 0, extra Second Winds, and so forth.  Which I never even needed to use.  But I was prepared, in case things ever got hard.The striker(s) would do insane damage and run around and make themselves hard to target, while I multi-marked and knocked things prone and slowed things and hit fairly hard for a defensively-focused character (2d10+26 usually), making myself enough of a nuisance that most of the time, most attacks were focused on me.  And then I'd heal myself back to full and become unhittable on any defense except with natural 20s for a round, and repeat that over and over.The creatures don't have enough hit points to outlast even one well-built epic striker's damage, and they sure as heck don't hit hard enough to outlast my obscene bucket of hit points and self-heals.  Oh, and that Font of Life save at the start of every turn pretty much made a mockery of most conditions they'd put on me.So yeah, if you're DMing and have an unkillable epic defender in the party, you need to ignore him and just stay after his friends, no matter how difficult or inconvienient they make that, because as Adamas the Uncarved would say, "Ye ain't gonna get blood from this stone!"Anyway, in fairness, some degree of the lack of challenge we experienced in E1 is the fault of our DM, and our own crazy-good characters.  But really, the module's encounters are NOT well-tuned for epic PCs of even moderate skill.  If we'd had three more friends with us, too, how silly would that have been?</blockquote>

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